East Region Fan Poll

[Oline89]

I agree with Pat here. Look, RPI is probably going to go 9-0. But the Engineers, record and ranking aside, feel to me like exactly the caliber of team that a playoff-caliber team needs to be able to beat at home. They're good, and they're beatable.

Frankly Ithaca's wins, while also not coming against RR teams, haven't exactly been a tour de force show of strength.

In their best win, at Alfred, they played a god-awful first half of football in every way, trailing 13-0. They needed a red zone stand to get out of St. John Fisher, of all places.

They're not even putting in 60 great minutes against the dregs of the league. In the Rochester game, the Yellow Jackets made 5 red zone trips, and three trips inside the 10. Credit IC's defense, sure. But when RPI got Rochester, they dominated them. Rochester got 4 first downs on its second drive, and three the rest of the game.

There's always a reason right? Nabi's been hurt for some of these games, Gladney's been hurt for others, and when they finally get them on the field at the same time, the weather is terrible and who can move the ball in a mud pit, anyway. But the line between reason and excuse is really thin when you're 8-2 as opposed to 9-1

Look, I'm an IC fan, and they have arguably the best defense in the region. And we've all seen what the Nabi-Gladney-Vito trio can do when it's clicking (witness the first half of Cortaca 2017).

There's a better Bombers team lurking somewhere in this one, but we haven't seen it yet

Dissatisfied with his the Bombers offense showed against St. Lawrence and Rochester? I've got a solution for you. Cut the grass at Butterfield ...or better yet, get in the 21st century, get turf ! .

Couldn't agree more, setting of the stadium is beautiful, great view of the lake, but the field was unplayable last weekend.  If ITH wants to play a fast pace offense, no huddle offense they have to upgrade the turf.   The mud, slop, high grass, and giant pitch to midfield works great if the plan is dominant defense, ground and pound offense and stopping other fast moving offenses

[MRMIKESMITH]

I agree with Pat here. Look, RPI is probably going to go 9-0. But the Engineers, record and ranking aside, feel to me like exactly the caliber of team that a playoff-caliber team needs to be able to beat at home. They're good, and they're beatable.

Frankly Ithaca's wins, while also not coming against RR teams, haven't exactly been a tour de force show of strength.

In their best win, at Alfred, they played a god-awful first half of football in every way, trailing 13-0. They needed a red zone stand to get out of St. John Fisher, of all places.

They're not even putting in 60 great minutes against the dregs of the league. In the Rochester game, the Yellow Jackets made 5 red zone trips, and three trips inside the 10. Credit IC's defense, sure. But when RPI got Rochester, they dominated them. Rochester got 4 first downs on its second drive, and three the rest of the game.

There's always a reason right? Nabi's been hurt for some of these games, Gladney's been hurt for others, and when they finally get them on the field at the same time, the weather is terrible and who can move the ball in a mud pit, anyway. But the line between reason and excuse is really thin when you're 8-2 as opposed to 9-1

Look, I'm an IC fan, and they have arguably the best defense in the region. And we've all seen what the Nabi-Gladney-Vito trio can do when it's clicking (witness the first half of Cortaca 2017).

There's a better Bombers team lurking somewhere in this one, but we haven't seen it yet

Dissatisfied with his the Bombers offense showed against St. Lawrence and Rochester? I've got a solution for you. Cut the grass at Butterfield ...or better yet, get in the 21st century, get turf ! .

Couldn't agree more, setting of the stadium is beautiful, great view of the lake, but the field was unplayable last weekend.  If ITH wants to play a fast pace offense, no huddle offense they have to upgrade the turf.   The mud, slop, high grass, and giant pitch to midfield works great if the plan is dominant defense, ground and pound offense and stopping other fast moving offenses

I strongly agree, that field was and Lake Erie was the worst fields I seen the Seagulls play on over the past 20 years.

[Caz Bombers]

Not sure Ithaca can or should turf Butterfield. Unlike many other schools at this level that have to have massively multi-use stadia, we already have a turf facility for soccer/field hockey/lacrosse to use. Also, I think the grass has to stay for the track and field throwing events. Can't imagine you want a javelin bouncing off those little packed pellets.

[jknezek]

Not sure Ithaca can or should turf Butterfield. Unlike many other schools at this level that have to have massively multi-use stadia, we already have a turf facility for soccer/field hockey/lacrosse to use. Also, I think the grass has to stay for the track and field throwing events. Can't imagine you want a javelin bouncing off those little packed pellets.

Most schools do it opposite. The soccer fields are grass, as they should be, and the football, field hockey and lacrosse fields are turfed. I hate turf soccer fields. As for track and field, events like the Javelin throw have specific tips for turf fields. Since they do the shotput at indoor meets, there is obviously a procedure in place for that event though like the discuss and hammer events, it would have little impact on a turf field if spread out. The weight of a discuss/shotput/hammer hitting the ground isn't more than a 300lb lineman slamming down. Most turf companies do warn about rotating the areas, or putting another rug on top of the expected repeated landing area, and there is skepticism about the rubber javelin tips. Still, it can be done.

[Bombers798891]

Couldn't agree more, setting of the stadium is beautiful, great view of the lake, but the field was unplayable last weekend.  If ITH wants to play a fast pace offense, no huddle offense they have to upgrade the turf.   The mud, slop, high grass, and giant pitch to midfield works great if the plan is dominant defense, ground and pound offense and stopping other fast moving offenses

I don't think that's the plan at all for Ithaca. Mike Toerper has put together one of the best defenses in the country, but Dan Swanstrom is the head coach, and he's not just an offensive guy, his specialty is quarterbacks.

You're right that Butterfield favors defenses. But I think one of the biggest misconceptions about the Butterfield grass is that it prevents the Bombers from having an explosive offense. Here's IC's PPG average at home from 2001-2008

2001: 41.8
2002: 34
2003: 26.5
2004: 43.3
2005: 36.4
2006: 36
2007: 32.6
2008: 39.5

This is, perhaps not coincidentally, IC's best stretch under Mike Welch. There's no reason the Bombers can't have an explosive offense on grass. They just haven't. Again, I'm guessing this is one of the reasons why Dan Swanstrom was hired.

I'm guessing, however, that Ithaca will eventually go to turf, for cost and multi-use reasons.

[Bombers798891]

Certainly all good points here...but again Ithaca defeats West Conn 9 out of 10 times...maybe 10 out of 10.

What were your thoughts before Ithaca/Curry '08?

That Curry team had been the cream of New England for 7-8 years consecutively and had playoff experience and were starting to become a wagon at that time. They were recruiting well and had great coaches. They can NOT be compared to this year's West Conn who can barely beat horrible teams.

To that, they also lost the following week to Cortland 42-0.

A Cortland team Ithaca had whipped 35-13 in the last week of the season, no less

[ITH radio]

Certainly all good points here...but again Ithaca defeats West Conn 9 out of 10 times...maybe 10 out of 10.

What were your thoughts before Ithaca/Curry '08?

That Curry team had been the cream of New England for 7-8 years consecutively and had playoff experience and were starting to become a wagon at that time. They were recruiting well and had great coaches. They can NOT be compared to this year's West Conn who can barely beat horrible teams.

To that, they also lost the following week to Cortland 42-0.

S/o for the Purple Drank throwback reference

[Ice Bear]

Certainly all good points here...but again Ithaca defeats West Conn 9 out of 10 times...maybe 10 out of 10.

What were your thoughts before Ithaca/Curry '08?

That Curry team had been the cream of New England for 7-8 years consecutively and had playoff experience and were starting to become a wagon at that time. They were recruiting well and had great coaches. They can NOT be compared to this year's West Conn who can barely beat horrible teams.

To that, they also lost the following week to Cortland 42-0.

A Cortland team Ithaca had whipped 35-13 in the last week of the season, no less

Mach's post says exactly what DB would say. The purple drank built that program up and was clearly the top of the heap of NE. They really opened the door for what seems like some growth from some other NE teams since then, (Salve, WNEU, Husson, Framingham). However those few schools tend to be the exception in NE and when they come out of NE come playoff time (as well as during the regular season) they usually lose to other ER teams.

Listen Buffalo St defeated Whitewater a couple years back? Upsets happen. How many times would they have defeated UDub if they played 10 times??? Maybe once, tops, probably zip. Use common sense here a bit. As stated in the past DB really does enjoy NE football and wants to see the level of play grow there across the board (and it has improved a bit IDBHO). Yet to start saying that simply based on a teams record against weaker opponents that they should be included in the TOP ten of the ER over a team with 2-3 loses that everyone on the planet knows is better...is ****ing stupid, IDBHO.

Using all the information we have, and using our best judgment the strongest teams in the ER, regardless of record, should be in the poll.

[MRMIKESMITH]

Certainly all good points here...but again Ithaca defeats West Conn 9 out of 10 times...maybe 10 out of 10.

What were your thoughts before Ithaca/Curry '08?

That Curry team had been the cream of New England for 7-8 years consecutively and had playoff experience and were starting to become a wagon at that time. They were recruiting well and had great coaches. They can NOT be compared to this year's West Conn who can barely beat horrible teams.

To that, they also lost the following week to Cortland 42-0.

A Cortland team Ithaca had whipped 35-13 in the last week of the season, no less

Mach's post says exactly what DB would say. The purple drank built that program up and was clearly the top of the heap of NE. They really opened the door for what seems like some growth from some other NE teams since then, (Salve, WNEU, Husson, Framingham). However those few schools tend to be the exception in NE and when they come out of NE come playoff time (as well as during the regular season) they usually lose to other ER teams.

Listen Buffalo St defeated Whitewater a couple years back? Upsets happen. How many times would they have defeated UDub if they played 10 times??? Maybe once, tops, probably zip. Use common sense here a bit. As stated in the past DB really does enjoy NE football and wants to see the level of play grow there across the board (and it has improved a bit IDBHO). Yet to start saying that simply based on a teams record against weaker opponents that they should be included in the TOP ten of the ER over a team with 2-3 loses that everyone on the planet knows is better...is ****ing stupid, IDBHO.

Using all the information we have, and using our best judgment the strongest teams in the ER, regardless of record, should be in the poll.

It still leaves that ONE TIME...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khauvdb_f8A

[Bartman]

Loved that locker room talk...lokks like saint Lawrence before the RPI game this Saturday

[Pat Coleman]

Hey I'm just going to share a post in here and let you guys keep talking.

Please please please I know we would all love to see another Cortaca, **** I would attend, but please please Ithaca and Cortland do not look past these two NEFC teams. Please throttle them both and send them back to New England so the NCAA idiots look more like idiots than they already do. I know PSU got the bid and for that they belong (obviously) but the one loss Curry is a joke. That is unless they win or even keep it close. Let's take care of business first and then talk Cortaca #II. I wrote this on the NJAC board, thought it should be said.

[ITH radio]

Rankings are out:

1. BP
2. FSU
3. RPI
4. DVC
5. CORT
6. SALS
7. WCT
8. USMMA
9. IC
10. WNE

[wesleydad]

Rankings are out:

1. BP
2. FSU
3. RPI
4. DVC
5. CORT
6. SALS
7. WCT
8. USMMA
9. IC
10. WNE

Wondering what puts Merchant Marine ahead of MIT since MIT has the H2H victory.  You can see that the committee was grasping for number 10 going with WNE.  Several other 2 loss teams probably should be in that spot.

[Bombers798891]

Mach's post says exactly what DB would say. The purple drank built that program up and was clearly the top of the heap of NE. They really opened the door for what seems like some growth from some other NE teams since then, (Salve, WNEU, Husson, Framingham). However those few schools tend to be the exception in NE and when they come out of NE come playoff time (as well as during the regular season) they usually lose to other ER teams.

Listen Buffalo St defeated Whitewater a couple years back? Upsets happen. How many times would they have defeated UDub if they played 10 times??? Maybe once, tops, probably zip. Use common sense here a bit. As stated in the past DB really does enjoy NE football and wants to see the level of play grow there across the board (and it has improved a bit IDBHO). Yet to start saying that simply based on a teams record against weaker opponents that they should be included in the TOP ten of the ER over a team with 2-3 loses that everyone on the planet knows is better...is ****ing stupid, IDBHO.

This is the problem I have. It's not the idea of the one off, "I think Ithaca is better than W. Conn in 2018" or whoever.

It's treating the idea that New England teams can't compete with New York teams as some sort of axiom, and questioning how could anyone think otherwise, and then we're all stunned because the first team to go 10-0 in the big, bad E8 needed overtime to beat two-loss Bridgewater at home, and a goal-line stand to sneak past Western New England.

[Bombers798891]

Rankings are out:

1. BP
2. FSU
3. RPI
4. DVC
5. CORT
6. SALS
7. WCT
8. USMMA
9. IC
10. WNE

So, if you're IC, is it possible to be the first Pool C team in the East?