East Region Fan Poll

[Bombers798891]

If it weren't for the two shady performances against Springfield and especially Utica I would still be defending to the death that this Fisher team is getting unjustly slammed...But they have been very unimpressive as of late.  I do however think that in the playoffs they could give any team in the East a run for their money.  People are acting as if Fisher is a run of the mill average team and that somebody like Cortland would run through them.  Well outside of Mount Union which is in another region and on another level, there is no team in the East that could blow out Fisher by say more than 2 touchdowns.  Just wouldn't happen....They would be close games and I'd venture to say Fisher would come out on the winning end more times than not against these other Eastern Region playoff teams.  I mean it's not like Salisbury and Hartwick buried us, it took phenomenal efforts on their part combined with Fisher mistakes to actually pull out the wins.  

Of course, if Utica, Rochester--and even to some degree Buffalo State, had the kind of QB play you're going to encounter in the East playoffs, you'd have lost those games.

To me, there's no defining victory for this SJF team...you could argue the IC game, but it was like 5 weeks ago and since then, SJF has looked so unimpressive, I wonder if that game was as much about IC and Juvan having a sort of mental disadvantage against SJF as it was the talent level of the teams. Remember, this game was close for about 40 minutes, but then IC crumbled. If they were to play again on Saturday, I would feel good about IC;s chances

[SJFF82]

If it weren't for the two shady performances against Springfield and especially Utica I would still be defending to the death that this Fisher team is getting unjustly slammed...But they have been very unimpressive as of late.  I do however think that in the playoffs they could give any team in the East a run for their money.  People are acting as if Fisher is a run of the mill average team and that somebody like Cortland would run through them.  Well outside of Mount Union which is in another region and on another level, there is no team in the East that could blow out Fisher by say more than 2 touchdowns.  Just wouldn't happen....They would be close games and I'd venture to say Fisher would come out on the winning end more times than not against these other Eastern Region playoff teams.  I mean it's not like Salisbury and Hartwick buried us, it took phenomenal efforts on their part combined with Fisher mistakes to actually pull out the wins.  

Of course, if Utica, Rochester--and even to some degree Buffalo State, had the kind of QB play you're going to encounter in the East playoffs, you'd have lost those games.

To me, there's no defining victory for this SJF team...you could argue the IC game, but it was like 5 weeks ago and since then, SJF has looked so unimpressive, I wonder if that game was as much about IC and Juvan having a sort of mental disadvantage against SJF as it was the talent level of the teams. Remember, this game was close for about 40 minutes, but then IC crumbled. If they were to play again on Saturday, I would feel good about IC;s chances

Are you suggesting that the East Region play-off teams are Buff St, UR and Utica...but with a good QB?  I think I get your point and perhaps agree with it, but if you meant that throw a good QB on Utica and suddenly they are IC or Cortland like some sort of magic trick then I disagree.

BTW, did IC crumble after 40 min, or did the cream rise to the top in the 4th?  Depends on how you look at it right?  Certainly that cream is now getting moldy, but at the time it was Cream nonetheless   Also, would that hypothetical rematch on Saterday happen to be at Growney again or at Butterfield?  I would like to go....to see the 4th quarter again

[SJFF82]

Of course, if Utica, Rochester--and even to some degree Buffalo State, had the kind of QB play you're going to encounter in the East playoffs, you'd have lost those games.

Utica had 74 yds offense...how much would a QB had helped?

[lewdogg11]

Look, i think Fisher fans are just getting a taste of what they have dished out for the past few years.  It's bitter sweet for some other posters to bash Fisher.   Since SJF has turned the corner, some of the posters on these boards have put down every other team as being inferior to them, whether it was their weak schedules, or their playoff losses, or their slim margin of victory over lesser quality opponents, it was dished out pretty heavily.  And through this, Fisher continued to produce on the field, so there wasn't much anyone could say otherwise.

This year, the shoe is on the other foot.  We can ignore the Mount Union and Salisbury losses.  Barely beating weak teams has traditionally been trashed on these boards, and Fisher is in that seat this year.  I agree, that most likely, they can compete with anyone in the East, but unfortunately, other than in an ECAC game, they probably won't get that chance.  But while they can compete, they definately aren't BETTER than everyone else.  You can't be on top every year, so some of you extreme Fisher fans need to realize that as soon as there is an opening to bash someone who has been on top for a while, the ooportunity will be taken advantage of.  Next year is a new year, but this year, you just aren't THAT good and the results have shown that.  It's not a shot at your program, it's a shot at this year's team and their results.

[AUPepBand]

Look, i think Fisher fans are just getting a taste of what they have dished out for the past few years.  It's bitter sweet for some other posters to bash Fisher.   Since SJF has turned the corner, some of the posters on these boards have put down every other team as being inferior to them, whether it was their weak schedules, or their playoff losses, or their slim margin of victory over lesser quality opponents, it was dished out pretty heavily.  And through this, Fisher continued to produce on the field, so there wasn't much anyone could say otherwise.

This year, the shoe is on the other foot.  We can ignore the Mount Union and Salisbury losses.  Barely beating weak teams has traditionally been trashed on these boards, and Fisher is in that seat this year.  I agree, that most likely, they can compete with anyone in the East, but unfortunately, other than in an ECAC game, they probably won't get that chance.  But while they can compete, they definately aren't BETTER than everyone else.  You can't be on top every year, so some of you extreme Fisher fans need to realize that as soon as there is an opening to bash someone who has been on top for a while, the ooportunity will be taken advantage of.  Next year is a new year, but this year, you just aren't THAT good and the results have shown that.  It's not a shot at your program, it's a shot at this year's team and their results.

Well said, LD...+k

[Knightstalker]

There are three teams that have distanced themselves from the rest of the East.  Cortland, RPI and Ithaca.  Cortland and RPI have beaten everyone in their path so far and Ithaca has only lost to Fisher, which is Fishers best win this season and probably the best game they played.

[theoriginalupstate]

Look, i think Fisher fans are just getting a taste of what they have dished out for the past few years.  It's bitter sweet for some other posters to bash Fisher.   Since SJF has turned the corner, some of the posters on these boards have put down every other team as being inferior to them, whether it was their weak schedules, or their playoff losses, or their slim margin of victory over lesser quality opponents, it was dished out pretty heavily.  And through this, Fisher continued to produce on the field, so there wasn't much anyone could say otherwise.

This year, the shoe is on the other foot.  We can ignore the Mount Union and Salisbury losses.  Barely beating weak teams has traditionally been trashed on these boards, and Fisher is in that seat this year.  I agree, that most likely, they can compete with anyone in the East, but unfortunately, other than in an ECAC game, they probably won't get that chance.  But while they can compete, they definately aren't BETTER than everyone else.  You can't be on top every year, so some of you extreme Fisher fans need to realize that as soon as there is an opening to bash someone who has been on top for a while, the ooportunity will be taken advantage of.  Next year is a new year, but this year, you just aren't THAT good and the results have shown that.  It's not a shot at your program, it's a shot at this year's team and their results.

Good post...

+K...

[maxpower]

I see cstate lurking... hope you're warming up your vocal cords for next week.

Oh, sorry, I forgot you went to Cortland; vocal cords are these things in your neck that help you speak.

[Frank Rossi]

Not to beat a dead horse, but Husson would be just one slot outside a playoff slot if Hobart loses to RPI this weekend.  The reason is because the Rowan/Montclair loser likely falls under Husson.  I believe that the East will get a maximum of 7 slots this year (5 conference winners and 2 Pool C bids). 

The BEST-case scenario for the East is if Husson wins a Pool B bid and this frees up a second Pool C bid for an East team.  This is likely the ONLY way the East can fill its own bracket this year.  However, the likelihood of Husson winning a Pool B bid is low -- the Huntington/LaGrange winner, Wesley and Case Western are in pretty safe Pool B positions right now.

[Bombers798891]

If it weren't for the two shady performances against Springfield and especially Utica I would still be defending to the death that this Fisher team is getting unjustly slammed...But they have been very unimpressive as of late.  I do however think that in the playoffs they could give any team in the East a run for their money.  People are acting as if Fisher is a run of the mill average team and that somebody like Cortland would run through them.  Well outside of Mount Union which is in another region and on another level, there is no team in the East that could blow out Fisher by say more than 2 touchdowns.  Just wouldn't happen....They would be close games and I'd venture to say Fisher would come out on the winning end more times than not against these other Eastern Region playoff teams.  I mean it's not like Salisbury and Hartwick buried us, it took phenomenal efforts on their part combined with Fisher mistakes to actually pull out the wins.  

Of course, if Utica, Rochester--and even to some degree Buffalo State, had the kind of QB play you're going to encounter in the East playoffs, you'd have lost those games.

To me, there's no defining victory for this SJF team...you could argue the IC game, but it was like 5 weeks ago and since then, SJF has looked so unimpressive, I wonder if that game was as much about IC and Juvan having a sort of mental disadvantage against SJF as it was the talent level of the teams. Remember, this game was close for about 40 minutes, but then IC crumbled. If they were to play again on Saturday, I would feel good about IC;s chances

Are you suggesting that the East Region play-off teams are Buff St, UR and Utica...but with a good QB?  I think I get your point and perhaps agree with it, but if you meant that throw a good QB on Utica and suddenly they are IC or Cortland like some sort of magic trick then I disagree.

BTW, did IC crumble after 40 min, or did the cream rise to the top in the 4th?  Depends on how you look at it right?  Certainly that cream is now getting moldy, but at the time it was Cream nonetheless   Also, would that hypothetical rematch on Saterday happen to be at Growney again or at Butterfield?  I would like to go....to see the 4th quarter again

No...I guess what I mean is that, overall, even past the QB, you're going to be facing more talented teams than Rochester, Utica, Buff State and Springfield. The QB seems to be the biggest glaring weakness for all those teams. As you said,  Utica only had 77 total yards of offense. And it was still a close game. Do you honestly think that the teams you face in the playoffs will be that inept on offense?

Sure, it depends on how you want to look at the IC/SJF game, but at the same time, you and I both know that the Fisher team that showed up in that 4th quarter is not the same team you're seeing now. As you put it, the cream has gotten moldy.

The problem I've had with some of your friends posts is that, when you talk about how good SJF is, we never discuss how poorly the team plays. We're only supposed to look at the good, (The 4th quarter against IC, "Almost" beating Salisbury, "Almost" beating Hartwick, "Giving Mt Union their closest game of the season.")

So why can't we look at the bad as well?

Also, if we're going back and rewatching games to determine relative strength, can we re-watch the Wick game? I've always been curious as to how it's possible for team's to only score 28 points against them...or only score 17 against Utica...or allow 35 to Springfield...because I saw those teams play and I was very unimpressed. Actually, I'd really like to know what a "close" game against Utica feels like...it's been so long since we've treated them like anything but a glorified practice session, I'd like to know what they look like when they're in a game for 4 quarters.

But I forgot...the Utica game and Springfield game don't count right? Because your fellow posters keep saying that the wins and losses are all that matter.

(Unless of course SJF loses. THEN, but only THEN, we are obligated to look beyond the result for subtle hints that SJF may be good.)

Look, this is my point. SJF fans keep wanting to freeze the season after the IC game. All the losses and struggles to terrible teams after that we're just supposed to ignore. Yeah, they had a nice impressive 4th against IC? And after that, when have they looked all that impressive? Losing to Wick? Losing to Salisbury because you couldn't hold a two score lead? Doing everything possible to lose to Springfield and Utica? You've had the 4th quarter of the IC game, the entire Norwich game, the Buff State game and if you want, 50 minutes of the Salisbury game. That's the extent to which Fisher's looked like a dominant team. That's the equivalent of three full games. You don't dominate terrible teams.

What playoff-caliber teams have you beaten? One team to this point? Actually, forget playoff caliber. You guys have beaten one team that's in the remote vicintity of .500.

[theoriginalupstate]

"The problem I've had with some of your friends posts is that, when you talk about how good SJF is, we never discuss how poorly the team plays. We're only supposed to look at the good, (The 4th quarter against IC, "Almost" beating Salisbury, "Almost" beating Hartwick, "Giving Mt Union their closest game of the season.")"


So Bombers, still think that the SJF offense is fine and my gripes are not substantiated.  If you question how they only score 28 on wick when you scored 69 and why they only scored 10 offensive points vs Utica obviously there's something wrong...

Im not here looking at the good at the season, if there has been any besides the IC game!  Their problem is that they're trying to reinvent themselves on offense with the wrong personnel vs a wicked schedule.  Not a smart move...

[Jonny Utah]

I'm not even trying to play devils advocate but I dont think the SJF posters have been that unreasonable.  They have been harsh and have said things that I would never say about Ithaca (I try to stay as positive as possible with kids who are trying to have fun out there).  But it almost seems to me that the fisher poster bashers are trying to use both arguments against these SJF posters.  Besides a few gripes about how SJF should be ranked above a few teams who haven't played anyone, I dont think any SJF posters have said anything that out of line other than being fans who care a lot about their team.

[Bombers798891]

"The problem I've had with some of your friends posts is that, when you talk about how good SJF is, we never discuss how poorly the team plays. We're only supposed to look at the good, (The 4th quarter against IC, "Almost" beating Salisbury, "Almost" beating Hartwick, "Giving Mt Union their closest game of the season.")"


So Bombers, still think that the SJF offense is fine and my gripes are not substantiated.  If you question how they only score 28 on wick when you scored 69 and why they only scored 10 offensive points vs Utica obviously there's something wrong...

Im not here looking at the good at the season, if there has been any besides the IC game!  Their problem is that they're trying to reinvent themselves on offense with the wrong personnel vs a wicked schedule.  Not a smart move...

To be fair, I said that BEFORE you only hung 10 on Utica...

I also said that SJF's biggest problem was not moving the ball---which they do very well--but turnovers. I then said that some turnovers can be the result of thing like poor-decision making (If a guy isn't open, don't throw the ball towards him), lack of focus ("Two hands Engelberg! Two hands!") and simple talent level (If the guy is open, but you miss him and it gets picked, you've got to make a better throw.) They're not always the result of a busted scheme.

In any season, there are going to be games, or periods of play where you don't play well. And periods where you play great. I guess, when I look at how good a team is, I say to myself "Ok which of these are the norm, and which are the exception?" For me, I haven't seen Fisher replicate those last 20 minutes against IC again, except for the Norwich game. By the same token, I haven't seen Ithaca replicate those last 20 minutes either. So for me, the last 20 minutes of the SJF/IC game isn't the norm for Fisher. What is? I don't know. But I don't believe that was it. It certainly isn't the norm for IC. So I'm not going to use that to define the season

I can see how my arguments can be an example of having my cake and eating it too. I guess we can never be purely objective. I saw SJF play a very good team, and I was impressed by them. I just want to see THAT team show up every week, or even two weeks in a row for crying out loud. They put together a good game, then they put together a clunker or two. Look at IC last season. They were 2-2, playoff lives on the line, and they spent the next six weeks kicking the crap out of people. No-one finished less than 3 scores behind them the rest of the seaon, and the only team that came within 20 was Alfred.

They're doing the same thing this season. They've looked terrible against SJF, took a loss, and they've done nothing but obliterate people since then. I'd like to see that from Fisher, you know? They're 3-3, and they've kind of sleepwalked though their last two games. This team knew they might need to go 7-3 after the Salisbury loss and even THAT might not be enough. Where's the fire? Where's the urgency? The IC game was in doubt, and it was like Fisher just said "screw this, we're not losing to you guys", hung something like 28 straight points on IC, and got me to leave the game early. Where's that extra gear been all season?

[SJFF82]

Many of us would like to know where that 'fire' went...

You say IC hasnt played like the 4th qu ag. SJF since....have they played SJF since or a team as good as SJF was that afternoon since?  I guess we will see this Saterday and next...I happen to believe you are correct although I do see IC losing 1 of the 2....hopefully they beat AU, so if it matters for SJF (depending on what Wick does) AU wont be all fired up playing for an NCAA berth

[Bombers798891]

Many of us would like to know where that 'fire' went...

You say IC hasnt played like the 4th qu ag. SJF since....have they played SJF since or a team as good as SJF was that afternoon since?  I guess we will see this Saterday and next...I happen to believe you are correct although I do see IC losing 1 of the 2....hopefully they beat AU, so if it matters for SJF (depending on what Wick does) AU wont be all fired up playing for an NCAA berth

You're right, IC hasn't--although you could argue they'd played two teams as good as SJF beforehand, Lycoming and Hartwick and never had a stretch even remotely as bad.

But SJF has played teams worse than IC, and looked nowhere near as good as they did in that quarter. The same teams Ithaca's beaten by 27, 29 and 35. 

I agree with you that IC will lose 1 of 2, but I think it will be Cortland, not Alfred