114th Annual Monon Bell Game

[DPULefty22]

OK, let's take this slow.

DPULefty,

"In the Millsaps game until the D ran out of gas???"  Are you being serious?  528 total yards for Millsaps & 475 of that through the air.  Yikes.  Wasn't it 28-3 at one point?

It was 14-3 after three quarters. Tiger O couldn't stay on the field because they couldn't get a consistent running game going.

Playing the Marks injury card...how about losing Dustin Huff for 8 games, how about not having Mike Russell for the first half of the season, losing our starting OT, losing a starting OG...would a, could a, should a......

That's fair.

Comparing Chris Creighton's Wabash Offense to Rhodes is a bit of a reach.  Rhodes averages 13.8 points per game.  Wabash averages 32.4 points per game and just under 400 yards per game in total O.

I wasn't intending to make a comparison in ability - clearly, that's not close. In fact, I really hadn't meant to make a comparison at all.

Who would have the better WR corps....Wabash, Millsaps, or Trinity???  I know who I would take.  I see another area of concern with regards to mismatches.

Truthfully, I'd probably take Trinity. And I'd take both Joseph and Barmore at QB over Hudson. But again, neither here nor there.

Didn't you barely beat Colorado College 41-40 in double OT?  Millsaps blasted them 68-6?  You guys play the weak schedule justification every year...who have you played?  Anderson?  Austin?  1-6 Birmingham-Southern was tough as nails in your decisive 28-24 win.

The swapping records statement is also a bold, very bold statement.

Sure it is. You're free to disagree. I think we've got a pretty good football team and that we'd acquit ourselves rather nicely in the NCAC.

What's your ALL TIME playoff record?

Objection! Relevance.

[DPU3619]

I don't think saying that one conference is better than the other has a whole lot of weight.  I think Wabash matches up better with Millsaps and Trinity if #4 is back there instead of Hudson, but that's relatively moot.

While the NCAC is a good golly awful 9-19 out of the conference and the SCAC is 10-4 out of the conference, that doesn't tell us much.  The SCAC's best out of conference opponents are the ASC's Miss. Coll. (Millsaps lost) and the UAA"s Wash U. (Rhodes got kicked in the teeth).

The conference argument is one that us DePauw folk have used each of the last two years, if I recall.  Certainly last year, and in '05 or '04.  I don't remember exactly.  They all blend together into pages and pages of arguing for me.  Anywho, that argument sure didn't get us very far.  I think saying that Wabash is weak because they haven't played anybody only works if DePauw can win one of these babies.  THEN we might have a case. 

My original point was that I think I'm being fair in saying that Wabash hasn't been truly tested by a good football team with a non-Huffian QB.  DePauw CAN play like that team this Saturday.  The question is whether you see the team that played well against Trinity early or the team that played poorly against Trinity late.  Maybe the few small tinkers they made to the pass defense scheme worked.  We won't know until Saturday.  Running them against Austin and Rhodes sure didn't tell me anything concrete.  They weren't healthy against TU and they weren't healthy against Millsaps.  They will be this Saturday.  They've really been truly healthy for the opener, and the last two weeks and that's it.  Is that enough?  I dunno.

[Ron Boerger]

No, it isn't really relevant but what is relevant from those games (and now is as good a time as any to start talking about past performance and stats and such), is that Trinity and Millsaps shredded DPU's defense.  Wabash comes to town with a more efficient passing game than either of those two teams.  I would have to think that this is concern A-1...far more than Wabash's defensive line is because if you can't keep the other guys out of the endzone it really won't matter if you're blocking Kennon or not. 

According to the most recent NCAA stats (a week old) Wabash holds a slim edge over Trinity when you look at the PER (Wabash is 8th [164.2], Trinity 13th [156.2]) but trails in term of yardage per game (292 Wabash to 311 Trinity).   So DePauw has seen a pretty good approximation of what they will face on Saturday; I would imagine the PER difference comes largely from a few more INTs thrown by Trinity.   

[WAF78]

As has already been mentioned on this thread...with no common opponents and different conferences in different parts of the country, it's virtually impossible to accurately compare the two teams. As far as conference strength is concerned...the SCAC was ranked 16th out of 25 while the NCAC was 18th....not a big difference.  Yes, the NCAC was a weak conference this year and was down...but the SCAC wasn't much better.
In yesteryear when DPU and Wabash were in the same conference...and then after that we played some similar teams...it was easier to gauge.
Also, I wouldn't make a big deal of beating Franklin with Huff vs. Hudson. Hudson has come a long way and has put up great numbers. With Huff being a 5th year senior...he'd have an edge between the two...but I'll take Hudson to face anyone...and I think we'd do just as well.
I look for it to be like the 2005 game...Wabash was undefeated...DePauw was 7-1 and it was at Greencastle. Wabash won by 3.
It'll be a great game. Just so sad that the game has become just like every other rivalry game. The thing that used to set Wabash/DePauw apart was the fan involvment before, during, and after the game. That may be why Keith McMillan didn't think it was really anything special when he attended the two Monon Bell games?  At least, that was the impression I got when he commented on attending. I reread the 1973 Sports Illustrated article about the Monon Bell game again to prepare for this week. If you have never read the piece by John Underwood, the renown SI writer, it's worth your time.

[gobash]

Huh, I got the impression Keith had a good time.  Wonder if we could get him in here to weigh in...we could pretend we have a beer for him, and lure him into the thread.

And I'm not sure I understand what you mean about fan involvement.  Wally and I annually broke into the president of our company's office by going up through the ceiling and over from a conference room and decking it all out in red and white.  She was a DPU grad, and she loved it.  She bought a banner one year that covered a large part of the front of the building, but what she didn't realize was that the letters were all stick on.  We had completely re-arranged the banner to support Wabash by the time she got in Monday morning, and made the Tiger paw look like it was flipping her off.

Good times.

[gobash83]

My original point was that I think I'm being fair in saying that Wabash hasn't been truly tested by a good football team with a non-Huffian QB. 

Wes, I think you are being unfair to Wittenberg (wow, it pains me to say that...lol).  Two losses (#18 Capital and #9 Wabash) certainly suggests that it is a good football team as much as a two loss team from the SCAC that has lost to #13 Trinity and an " also receiving votes" Milsaps.  Wabash played without Huff in that one and came out with the win.  Of course, these exercises are the stuff that bar bets and message boards live on...

Just so sad that the game has become just like every other rivalry game.   

I have to disagree with WAF78 on this one. I have attended every Monon Bell game in person since 1979 and I do not think that it has become just like every other rivalry game.  Instead, I think that it is difficult for those who are not in the Wabash or DPU communities to truly appreciate the depth of the rivalry.  That is not a criticism of Keith or anyone else...but instead a recognition that you have to be around the rivalry for a long time to get it.

I think it will be a great game between two teams that will play with intensity to the last whistle. 

[gobash]

From Keith's 2005 column:    http://www.d3football.com/atn.php?id=90

Since I was there, I can say that there Monon Bell game is second to none in Division III. Wabash and DePauw sit 27 miles apart in a stretch of central Indiana where there isn't much else to get excited about. But they've been doing the season-ending game for both teams big since 1890, and it's as chippy now as it ever was. Wabash hung on for a 17-14 win this season in a game where the play along the lines was fierce and both quarterbacks were warrior-like. They lead the series 52-51-9.

But no tale from game day summarizes how big the rivalry is like this does: As soon as I wrote I was coming, three Wabash e-mails arrived, politely thanking me for choosing to attend but mentioning how much better the game is when not at DePauw. Now that's a rivalry.

[wally_wabash]

No, it isn't really relevant but what is relevant from those games (and now is as good a time as any to start talking about past performance and stats and such), is that Trinity and Millsaps shredded DPU's defense.  Wabash comes to town with a more efficient passing game than either of those two teams.  I would have to think that this is concern A-1...far more than Wabash's defensive line is because if you can't keep the other guys out of the endzone it really won't matter if you're blocking Kennon or not. 

According to the most recent NCAA stats (a week old) Wabash holds a slim edge over Trinity when you look at the PER (Wabash is 8th [164.2], Trinity 13th [156.2]) but trails in term of yardage per game (292 Wabash to 311 Trinity).   So DePauw has seen a pretty good approximation of what they will face on Saturday; I would imagine the PER difference comes largely from a few more INTs thrown by Trinity.   

The per game yardage is a little uneven...of course, Wabash hasn't had the chance to throw on DPU's secondary yet.   

Huh, I got the impression Keith had a good time.  Wonder if we could get him in here to weigh in...we could pretend we have a beer for him, and lure him into the thread.

I recall reading K-Mack's blog from Blackstock in '05 and it seemed like he enjoyed the experience.  I've since seen him post that Wabash/Depauw is at or near the top of the list of D-III rivalry games (the Cortaca Jug game being the other preeminent rivalry game).  And that's not to say that others aren't awesome in their own way...they're all unique and different and special in their own way.  I don't think it's fair to say which is better.  They're all good, they're just all good in their own way. 

And I'm not sure I understand what you mean about fan involvement.  Wally and I annually broke into the president of our company's office by going up through the ceiling and over from a conference room and decking it all out in red and white.  She was a DPU grad, and she loved it.  She bought a banner one year that covered a large part of the front of the building, but what she didn't realize was that the letters were all stick on.  We had completely re-arranged the banner to support Wabash by the time she got in Monday morning, and made the Tiger paw look like it was flipping her off.

Good times.

[bashbrother]

I think WAF78 is looking for a little more of this



We just can't steal borrow something we already have. 

[DPU3619]

Wes, I think you are being unfair to Wittenberg (wow, it pains me to say that...lol).  Two losses (#18 Capital and #9 Wabash) certainly suggests that it is a good football team as much as a two loss team from the SCAC that has lost to #13 Trinity and an " also receiving votes" Milsaps.  Wabash played without Huff in that one and came out with the

Perhaps.  I may concede that, but I'm not sure that changes my conclusion much.  Maybe I did sell Witt a tad short.  The Cap result does say a lot about Witt, I think.  Dunno why you'd want to go ahead and get your post-season hopes dashed right out of the gate, but whatever, man.  I'd really hate to be in a situation where I knew I had to beat Wabash to get in the playoffs (2005). 

Anywho, 7-2 Witt played Wabash close, and I think if 7-2 DePauw plays well, they'll play Wabash close, as well.  They'll have to run the ball better than Witt did, that's for sure.

As I said, I don't think it makes that big of a difference.  Everybody knows what each team is going to do.  Everybody knows how talented the other team is.  Everybody knows what plays they're going to run.  This hasn't been much of a thinking man's series over the past few years.  Not sure anybody has out smarted anybody else in recent years (maybe with the exception of the Creighton timeout to make DPU kick the FG into the wind at the end of the 1st Q in '05).  It seems to me that whoever executes better has won the football game.   Whether or not Wabash played good Witt, Wooster, and OWU or bad Witt, Wooster, and OWU may not effect how sharply the LG's execute in this football game.

[wally_wabash]

Perhaps.  I may concede that, but I'm not sure that changes my conclusion much.  Maybe I did sell Witt a tad short.  The Cap result does say a lot about Witt, I think.  Dunno why you'd want to go ahead and get your post-season hopes dashed right out of the gate, but whatever, man.  I'd really hate to be in a situation where I knew I had to beat Wabash to get in the playoffs (2005). 

Anywho, 7-2 Witt played Wabash close, and I think if 7-2 DePauw plays well, they'll play Wabash close, as well.  They'll have to run the ball better than Witt did, that's for sure.

As I said, I don't think it makes that big of a difference.  Everybody knows what each team is going to do.  Everybody knows how talented the other team is.  Everybody knows what plays they're going to run.  This hasn't been much of a thinking man's series over the past few years.  Not sure anybody has out smarted anybody else in recent years (maybe with the exception of the Creighton timeout to make DPU kick the FG into the wind at the end of the 1st Q in '05).  It seems to me that whoever executes better has won the football game.   Whether or not Wabash played good Witt, Wooster, and OWU or bad Witt, Wooster, and OWU may not effect how sharply the LG's execute in this football game.

This is the first time in the 8 years that Wabash has been playing Witt and DePauw in the same season that DePauw has a better run game than Witt.  And it's really not even close this time around. 

The thing with our game against Witt is that that game has become extraordinarily intense and extraordinarily huge.  Rarely does a week go by in the Springfield, OH fishwrap where a player or coach doesn't mention Wabash in some fashion...Wabash has become the game that they circle every year.  About the only thing that rivalry is missing right now is a traveling trophy and about 100 years of history.  Otherwise, the intensity (for players, coaches, and fans) is about the same as it is for the Bell game (state's exhibit A: Wabash drew over 4,000 for the Witt game this year...during fall break...there's only one other team we could schedule on fall break and draw that kind of crowd).  You can pretty much throw the records out when Witt and Wabash get together.  Of course, the game is typically for first place and a stranglehold on the conference title, so the records are pretty important. 

I digress...the point is that Witt is a good team and that game is a pretty intense rivalry game, so any win over Witt is a good win.

[Ralph Turner]

Please remember.  Keith is a former Randolph-Macon player.  He has his own "The Game"...RMC versus Hampden-Sydney. 

[INQBScout]

For Wabash postersl...who is the toughest team you've played this year...and why?

[wally_wabash]

For Wabash postersl...who is the toughest team you've played this year...and why?

I think the answer here is Franklin....Franklin is the best team on Wabash's 2007 schedule and Franklin had a one-game head start on Wabash. 

[DPU3619]

and Franklin had a one-game head start on Wabash. 

I'm not sure why the Franklin game is always clarified with that statement.  It's like you're trying to make the result sound better.  I don't understand.