BB: Regionals (West) 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011

[Ralph Turner]

...
If those truly are a reflection of a new President and a change in attitude on the importance of sports at TU in their overall approach to a college experience, my hope is that will allow Coach Scannell to be able to make that trip, or attract others to San Antonio that he could not do before.

I dread to ask this question for fear it comes true, but has Trinity ever considered challenging Williams on the national level for the Directors' Cup?

[Pat Coleman]

After reading some posts on the Central Regional board, I think I might have been misreading the OWP calculation methodology.  I assumed that each in-region "game" counted against OWP, but actually it seems to be each in region "opponent" regardless of the number of games between opponents.

That nuance makes a pretty big difference for Trinity; it actually puts their OWP at over 500 on my quick and dirty spreadsheet.  Probably not exact, but definitely closer to 500 than the 450 they are currently listed as on the SOS table.

Not trying to open up a can of worms, but which way is correct?  Would love for some to check my math in this case.  

Bmo -- the original assumption is the correct one. The handbook's description of the process is oversimplified.

The numbers the NCAA uses are almost exactly identical to the ones we post, when I cross-check them. Close enough that the differences must be one or two games across an entire opponents' opponents schedule, rather than a wholesale difference in calculation.

[tigerfan_2001]

Yes, infielddad.  

What surprises me is that Trinity Athletics fans have not started an effective 501(c)3 thru which to funnel these monies.

I think that we do a very good job of playing all of the Texas teams.  TU, SW and AC all play enough midweek games that we get to see how deep the respective teams are.  That 4th starter is where we seem to be weak on a national basis.

McMurry had 13 unique West Region opponents in the regular season.

Trinity had 11; 5 SCAC-West, 5 ASC-West and University of Dallas.

Southwestern had 12; 5 SCAC-West, 7 ASC-West teams.

with regards to the 503 account, i do belive there is something to that effect.  When Coach Scannell go to TU, the athletic budget was miniscule.  They do fundraise now, as most teams do, and that still only gets them to where they are today.....still not enough to make huge expensive trips.

[infielddad]

...
If those truly are a reflection of a new President and a change in attitude on the importance of sports at TU in their overall approach to a college experience, my hope is that will allow Coach Scannell to be able to make that trip, or attract others to San Antonio that he could not do before.

I dread to ask this question for fear it comes true, but has Trinity ever considered challenging Williams on the national level for the Directors' Cup?

Ralph,
Having spent some time with Bob King over the past 10 years, I think Trinity sees the Emory model more realistic, at least that is the history especially with the most recent President. Since the new President arrived in January and they already have major additions and remodel projects announced for soccer, maybe the model will change.

[Bmo]

After reading some posts on the Central Regional board, I think I might have been misreading the OWP calculation methodology.  I assumed that each in-region "game" counted against OWP, but actually it seems to be each in region "opponent" regardless of the number of games between opponents.

That nuance makes a pretty big difference for Trinity; it actually puts their OWP at over 500 on my quick and dirty spreadsheet.  Probably not exact, but definitely closer to 500 than the 450 they are currently listed as on the SOS table.

Not trying to open up a can of worms, but which way is correct?  Would love for some to check my math in this case.  

Bmo -- the original assumption is the correct one. The handbook's description of the process is oversimplified.

The numbers the NCAA uses are almost exactly identical to the ones we post, when I cross-check them. Close enough that the differences must be one or two games across an entire opponents' opponents schedule, rather than a wholesale difference in calculation.

Thanks Pat.  That makes the most sense. 

[D O.C.]

Personally, I like having the southern football teams in the West for baseball. We are exposed to so many more new names and ideas.

Thoughts on LINFIELD'S home cookin' for the regionals?

I saw Trinity come into Chapman a couple of years ago and that Foxy George snuck away with it all.

And the subject of home cookin', I cannot think of a bar-b-q joint in McMinnville. Then I do not live there. Wildcat11?

[infielddad]

  When Coach Scannell go to TU, the athletic budget was miniscule. 

tigerfan,
In my view, the baseball budget was less than miniscule. When one would look at budget and hear where Coach Scannell wanted his program and players to get, it seemed impossible,  especially for the program Coach Scannell envisioned and the National recruiting he needed to do.
It is a source of inspiration to realize that  every Trinity player, Trinity parent and Trinity coach  benefited, and is benefiting, from the  efforts of those who stepped up  and truly began to make a difference from what existed in 2001.

[infielddad]

Personally, I like having the southern football teams in the West for baseball. We are exposed to so many more new names and ideas.

Thoughts on LINFIELD'S home cookin' for the regionals?

I saw Trinity come into Chapman a couple of years ago and that Foxy George snuck away with it all.

And the subject of home cookin', I cannot think of a bar-b-q joint in McMinnville. Then I do not live there. Wildcat11?

D.O.C.,
I'd say the 18-19 innings piled on the right arm of Scott Hyde in those 4 days  is what made the difference.  Those were two very good teams, as evidenced by George Fox winning the CWS, and were equal in every other way.

[CrashDavisD3]

Personally, I like having the southern football teams in the West for baseball. We are exposed to so many more new names and ideas.

Thoughts on LINFIELD'S home cookin' for the regionals?

I saw Trinity come into Chapman a couple of years ago and that Foxy George snuck away with it all.

And the subject of home cookin', I cannot think of a bar-b-q joint in McMinnville. Then I do not live there. Wildcat11?

Went here several times last year we groups of fans, parents, players...in McMinnville
http://www.goldenvalleybrewery.com/restaurant.htm

[BigPoppa]

Personally, I like having the southern football teams in the West for baseball. We are exposed to so many more new names and ideas.

Thoughts on LINFIELD'S home cookin' for the regionals?

I saw Trinity come into Chapman a couple of years ago and that Foxy George snuck away with it all.

And the subject of home cookin', I cannot think of a bar-b-q joint in McMinnville. Then I do not live there. Wildcat11?

D.O.C.,
I'd say the 18-19 innings piled on the right arm of Scott Hyde in those 4 days  is what made the difference.  Those were two very good teams, as evidenced by George Fox winning the CWS, and were equal in every other way.

I watched that entire regional... Hyde was filthy all weekend.

[Ron Boerger]

...
If those truly are a reflection of a new President and a change in attitude on the importance of sports at TU in their overall approach to a college experience, my hope is that will allow Coach Scannell to be able to make that trip, or attract others to San Antonio that he could not do before.

I dread to ask this question for fear it comes true, but has Trinity ever considered challenging Williams on the national level for the Directors' Cup?

Ralph,
Having spent some time with Bob King over the past 10 years, I think Trinity sees the Emory model more realistic, at least that is the history especially with the most recent President. Since the new President arrived in January and they already have major additions and remodel projects announced for soccer, maybe the model will change.

I don't see Trinity trying to be a Williams.   They have a couple of top-five Directors Cup finishes to their credit and placing there on a more consistent basis seems to be a reasonable expectation.  

With re the funding for the athletics programs, the donors who have the money have, with few exceptions (the Bell family, for example, who replaced a sad little indoor complex with the really nice facility you see today), put their support behind academics and academic-related facilities.  And that's the way it should be ... but the recent comment by Bob King about the soccer upgrades representing the start of upgrades to other athletic facilities is nothing but heartening, *and* the timing cannot be a coincidence.   Huzzah, Dr. Ahlberg!  You and your spouse (Penelope Harley, J.D.) are apparently shaking all sorts of things up on the Hill.  

[Ralph Turner]

My comments on the financial support of athletics had more to do with proportional support for a school whose endowment is comparable to the private D-1's in this part of the country.

Even doubling the number of pennies in the budget for athletics would have a huge impact on the whole program.

[Ron Boerger]

Ah, but that would require a sea change from the top - previous administrations have not felt that kind of athletic funding is a priority.  Maybe Dr. Ahlberg will lead the school that way, but if not private funding will be what fills the gap.

On a related tangent, I've often wondered why the school doesn't have a marching band in the vein of McMurry or Hardin-Simmons - since marching bands generally support football teams (and then basketball season), that's another aspect a school supporting athletics.  In my day we had a student-run stand band because the school didn't have one (tho it used to back in scholarship days).  Last fall year some students got together and created a new (better quality!) stand band ... and the athletic program had to fund the instruments because the music program apparently wasn't interested.   Who knows where they found the money, but they did.  Net-net - if the school can't find $30-40K (est.) for instruments to support a band that focuses on supporting athletics, it's not going supply funding to Williams-ize the program.   Hopefully Dr. A will change that. 

[Pat Coleman]

Music departments don't generally care much for pep bands, to be honest. I know at Catholic when I was a student it was student-funded, from the activities fee, and the players supplied their own instruments. Later there was a bigger group with a "faculty" director, but that was funded by a specific donor and the director wasn't exactly happy to be there.

[dahlby]

Having at least a pep band to play during athletic events is all part of the D3 sports experience. Chapman started one a few years ago for the football games, then expanded it to the basketball season this year, even when there were only a few hundred fans in the gym.

The students (and parents, etc.) loved it. It increased the spirit and did bring students back. Also having a good group of cheerleaders helped  increase student involvement.