Conference changes

[Greek Tragedy]

So, if they rebrand, don't they lose their AQ? When the LMC and the NIIC combined, they lost their AQ when they rebranded as the (now) NACC, correct? What's the difference?

Also, I think it's ridiculous to have a conference where teams don't even play a conference schedule...and on top of that, they keep their AQ simply by having a 4-team conference tournament. That really seems like cheating the system, IMO.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Same conference, new name. They keep the AQ, like the ARC.

[CNU85]

January? Were you asleep in November and December? Hahahaha.... (Joking).

The word was spreading around that time. Even hit the newspapers in mid December. But all they had was a few lines here and there. I appreciated your comments and thoughts as they were more detailed and informative.

I knew about a LOT for the last few years. I had heard about this idea around mid-December as well, but I had it confirmed through sources in mid-January that it was approved by both conferences (as much as the CAC would like to spin this as new members, it is a merger). We reported on that confirmation in January on the show. We have talked about it on the show ever since. Not one call or email telling us our information was inaccurate. I do my best to only report what I am absolutely sure about through confirmed sources.

BTW the mid-December story was the former CAC member indicating he had six members in mind for the conference. I knew who he was talking about within a few days, but nothing we could officially report. Just hint about.

It was indeed a poorly kept secret. Even the local newspaper guys reported in December that it was the ACAA. And what do they know?   

[CNU85]

It was recently announced that Bob Jones, Warren Wilson, and Manor will officially start the transition to DIII. There has been speculation that Bob Jones and maybe Warren Wilson would join the USA South, but I am just not sure that will happen. There is nothing official and the USAS is WAY too big. I am not sure it can take more members. This new CAC would be perfect for Bob Jones and Warren Wilson until something more suitable comes along (like the USA South finally splits, which as of last December had cooled in terms of happening).

Manor I'm told was already in talks with the ACAA on joining ... so I expect to see their name in this new group rather soon. I think a lot of other conferences will want to see new DIII members join a conference like the new CAC before then joining another conference. That allows other conferences not to have to baby sit and takes them when the schools and departments are a bit more DIII-mature.

As for a new name for the CAC ... interesting. Not sure what they will call themselves.

How about the Nursery Conference? 

Love it. Or the Incubator Athletic Conference.

[Caz Bombers]

I'm sure I could find similar dumb responses on Twitter, but it's funny to see how many people commenting on each CAC school athletics Facebook page definitely did not read the article.

[Gregory Sager]

So, if they rebrand, don't they lose their AQ? When the LMC and the NIIC combined, they lost their AQ when they rebranded as the (now) NACC, correct? What's the difference?

Also, I think it's ridiculous to have a conference where teams don't even play a conference schedule...and on top of that, they keep their AQ simply by having a 4-team conference tournament. That really seems like cheating the system, IMO.

They don't even need the conference tournament to keep the autobid. The NCAA allows every league to determine its own method of selecting its automatic representative to the national tournament. Remember, the UAA doesn't even have a conference tournament.

If it suited the CAC's fancy, the league could even let Ken Massey's computer algorithm select their AQ. Heck, they can blindfold Ken Massey and let him pick the AQ out of a hat if they want. By the NCAA's own rules, that's the league's right.

[sncdangler]

Rumor and innuendo on the street have St. Scholastica becoming a full MIAC member. Anyone hear anything about this?

[Caz Bombers]

So, if they rebrand, don't they lose their AQ? When the LMC and the NIIC combined, they lost their AQ when they rebranded as the (now) NACC, correct? What's the difference?

Also, I think it's ridiculous to have a conference where teams don't even play a conference schedule...and on top of that, they keep their AQ simply by having a 4-team conference tournament. That really seems like cheating the system, IMO.

They don't even need the conference tournament to keep the autobid. The NCAA allows every league to determine its own method of selecting its automatic representative to the national tournament. Remember, the UAA doesn't even have a conference tournament.

If it suited the CAC's fancy, the league could even let Ken Massey's computer algorithm select their AQ. Heck, they can blindfold Ken Massey and let him pick the AQ out of a hat if they want. By the NCAA's own rules, that's the league's right.

I think they should hold all conference tournaments via Zoom, head coaches will face off in best-of-seven Rock Paper Scissors battles, spelling bees, and pub trivia. Best combined score wins the Pool A berth!

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

so if I'm reading both CAC and ACAA standings pages correctly, for AQ sports this is what we're left with, pending what Dave said somewhere about leagues being able to fall below 7 and not have to worry about losing Pool A...

FALL
Field Hockey - 2-year grace period was ending anyway and no newbies play. By Fall '21 only SAL/CNU/UMW will be left. Pool B.
Women's Soccer - up to 10 this fall, then down to 8 after that. A bid safe.
Volleyball - up to 10 this fall, then 8, A bid safe. **I think Pine Manor is dropping volleyball immediately.**
Men's Soccer - up to 10, then down to 7. A bid safe, but barely.

WINTER
Men's Basketball - up to 9, then down to 6. They re-start the clock on the grace period and would be Pool B in '22-23.
Women's Basketball - up to 10, then down to 7. A bid narrowly stays safe.

SPRING
Baseball - next year would be year 2 of the grace period with Pine Manor replacing York as team #6. It sounds like Finlandia is staying in the WIAC. Would go to Pool B in '22 as only 3 teams will be left.
Softball - next year would be year 2 of the grace period, looks like they'll only have 6 since evidently PMC isn't going to continue with softball. Pool B in '22 with only 5 teams remaining.
Men's and Women's Lacrosse - see Field Hockey, except they keep A bid next spring and set to go into B in '22.
Men's Golf - clock starts with York gone and no newbies participating. B in '23.
Women's Golf - never had the A bid to begin with.
Men's Tennis - gets back to 7 teams next year, clock re-starts when they drop to 5 in spring '22. Pool in '24.
Women's Tennis - gets back up to 8 teams next year, but then drop to 6, which would send them to Pool B in '24.

You have men's basketball I think wrong ... when the grace period restarts - it restarts at two years. So they are fine for 20-21, then the clock would start for 21-22 meaning they would go through 22-23 with the Pool A before then going to Pool B for 23-24.

And with the Pool Bs the way the CAC as itself, they are going to gobble that bid up. Those teams are likely getting in just a step sooner than they normally do. And those who don't get the Pool B will be strong Pool C contenders.

But also keep this in mind: they will gain more members. As I think I mentioned earlier, there are three schools in the DIII pipeline now that easily could become even temporary members: Bob Jones, Warren Wilson, and Manor. I have it on good authority that Manor had been talking to the ACAA already. I don't think Bob Jones and Warren Wilson have a conference home as of yet - especially the USA South which just can't take any more growth realistically. Thus that could be three more members and the rule now allows those members to count as conference members far sooner than in the past (almost immediately, but I have screwed that up of late; reclassifying members count as core as of January for example). So the numbers would increase in a lot of sports.

Plus, the conference is going to end up being the home for a number of schools transitioning into DIII or need to leave their conference (I am not saying this would happen, but I do wonder if Morrisville State has enough of the NEAC, for example, and joins this group; not necessarily a great fit, but things like that could happen). So these numbers are going to fluctuate often and they may be in and out of the grace period clock (as long as they don't dip below four members per sport) often.

[Gregory Sager]

So, if they rebrand, don't they lose their AQ? When the LMC and the NIIC combined, they lost their AQ when they rebranded as the (now) NACC, correct? What's the difference?

Also, I think it's ridiculous to have a conference where teams don't even play a conference schedule...and on top of that, they keep their AQ simply by having a 4-team conference tournament. That really seems like cheating the system, IMO.

They don't even need the conference tournament to keep the autobid. The NCAA allows every league to determine its own method of selecting its automatic representative to the national tournament. Remember, the UAA doesn't even have a conference tournament.

If it suited the CAC's fancy, the league could even let Ken Massey's computer algorithm select their AQ. Heck, they can blindfold Ken Massey and let him pick the AQ out of a hat if they want. By the NCAA's own rules, that's the league's right.

I think they should hold all conference tournaments via Zoom, head coaches will face off in best-of-seven Rock Paper Scissors battles, spelling bees, and pub trivia. Best combined score wins the Pool A berth!

Ha! But they should use Rock Paper Scissors Lizard Spock instead ... fewer tiebreakers necessary.

[Caz Bombers]

you're right Dave, I mistyped in the MBB segment, I'll fix that, thanks.

[Caz Bombers]

St. Scholastica from UMAC to MIAC in 2021-22. Macalester also returning to the fold in football.

https://www.miacathletics.com/general/2019-20/releases/20200526avs20a

[Gregory Sager]

Rumor and innuendo on the street have St. Scholastica becoming a full MIAC member. Anyone hear anything about this?

Good scoop. You actually beat the MIAC press release by a few hours.

[Pat Coleman]

I didn't answer the post because I wasn't sure what point over the past 15 years Dangler was referring to. Longest courtship ever.

[Greek Tragedy]

Same conference, new name. They keep the AQ, like the ARC.

So the LMC and the NIIC combined, with a different conference name. But the CAC takes all the ACAA teams and changes the name, but that's different somehow?

Also, you can't compare what the CAC/ACAA "merger" as "Same conference, new name. They keep the AQ, like the ARC" because the ARC just changed their name, they didn't add a different conference's members.