Conference changes

[Pat Coleman]

heck, just look at Bluffton's website...yes the score is there.. accompanied by the words "NCAA non-countable opponent"...   

Psst -- that's on there because they use PrestoSports, like we do, and I put those words in the database for that game.

[thebear]

By the way, as far as the players, the most I was able to find was one player who played four sports.  Football, basketball, tennis and wrestling I think.

Jim Brown played Football [College and Pro Hall of Fame], basketball [averaged double figures as a junior], Lacrosse [Hall of Fame, changed the rules because of him], and track and field [scored 5,500 points in the AAU nationals to place 5th in 1955] at Syracuse in the 50's.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

The school asked you not to keep hounding them about it and told you the team existed and the games were legit. We found nothing to dispute that.

This isn't entirely true; at least from my end.  I found absolutely zero evidence the basketball team represented an existing institution.  The organization that had, at one time, been Ohio Midwestern, had no knowledge of the team.  What was never nailed down was whether their opponents knew what was going on.  There are actually a lot of possibilities to explain; we just weren't able to track down anything.

It's an odd, odd situation, but, again, you have to be able to give these schools a break at some point.  They're just not operating on the level of the big boys, even in Division III.

I conveyed everything I was told by the coaches to everyone in our group ... at first, it was conveyed to me the opponents were curious who the opponent was. I asked opponents to get back to me if they had further problems when they got closer to the game (or at the event). The fact none of them got back to me (and I talked to one of the coaches SEVERAL times afterward) ... I took that as a sign they didn't really have an issue.

BTW - just because a game is rules as a non-countable game by the NCAA doesn't mean the game, team, or other stuff didn't exist. It just means when it comes to their overall record and NCAA stats, they aren't included. Many teams play teams that aren't in the NCAA and they don't mean more than having a game. It doesn't mean there is a scam or something going on.

Sure ... we couldn't find who this program was. I never disputed that. But a team was put on the floor and I didn't get any complaints from those involved after I asked them to let me know if there were issues. They apparently didn't feel it was that big a deal.

I also never said it wasn't a big deal. I simply said it wasn't something worth making a major deal out of. I don't agree it was a scam. If the coach keeps going to that well and those in the tournament are fed up with it ... they will handle it.

[Ryan Stoppable]

St. Norbert moves from the Midwest Conference to the NACC starting in 2020-21.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

St. Norbert moves from the Midwest Conference to the NACC starting in 2020-21.

I thought that came up already ... I've lost track.

They and York (Pa.) moving to the MAC Commonwealth in the same year.

[Mr. Ypsi]

The school asked you not to keep hounding them about it and told you the team existed and the games were legit. We found nothing to dispute that.

This isn't entirely true; at least from my end.  I found absolutely zero evidence the basketball team represented an existing institution.  The organization that had, at one time, been Ohio Midwestern, had no knowledge of the team.  What was never nailed down was whether their opponents knew what was going on.  There are actually a lot of possibilities to explain; we just weren't able to track down anything.

It's an odd, odd situation, but, again, you have to be able to give these schools a break at some point.  They're just not operating on the level of the big boys, even in Division III.

I conveyed everything I was told by the coaches to everyone in our group ... at first, it was conveyed to me the opponents were curious who the opponent was. I asked opponents to get back to me if they had further problems when they got closer to the game (or at the event). The fact none of them got back to me (and I talked to one of the coaches SEVERAL times afterward) ... I took that as a sign they didn't really have an issue.

BTW - just because a game is rules as a non-countable game by the NCAA doesn't mean the game, team, or other stuff didn't exist. It just means when it comes to their overall record and NCAA stats, they aren't included. Many teams play teams that aren't in the NCAA and they don't mean more than having a game. It doesn't mean there is a scam or something going on.

Sure ... we couldn't find who this program was. I never disputed that. But a team was put on the floor and I didn't get any complaints from those involved after I asked them to let me know if there were issues. They apparently didn't feel it was that big a deal.

I also never said it wasn't a big deal. I simply said it wasn't something worth making a major deal out of. I don't agree it was a scam. If the coach keeps going to that well and those in the tournament are fed up with it ... they will handle it.

Yes, but none of them lost to 'Midwestern'.  If they had, I bet it would've been a 'big deal'.

[Gregory Sager]

I think that you're being generous in referring to Ohio Midwestern as a "program", Dave. If none of the coaches whose teams played in the Bluffton tournament objected to playing the group of guys who called themselves "Ohio Midwestern", then that's fine, and it's ultimately all that matters here ... but it sure seems to me that at best their mystery opponent was merely a team with the name of a now-defunct school on its uniforms, not a "program".

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I think that you're being generous in referring to Ohio Midwestern as a "program", Dave. If none of the coaches whose teams played in the Bluffton tournament objected to playing the group of guys who called themselves "Ohio Midwestern", then that's fine, and it's ultimately all that matters here ... but it sure seems to me that at best their mystery opponent was merely a team with the name of a now-defunct school on its uniforms, not a "program".

I (and I think Hopefan, as well) talked to the guy legally responsible for the records and transcripts of Ohio Midwestern - he had no idea they were still playing sports.  They're not currently offering classes outside of occasional evangelistic training when churches schedule them.  Like I said - I can think of a bunch of different ways this happened, but there's certainly no legal or internet presence anywhere.  I found it all more a curiosity than anything.

[Greek Tragedy]

Just moving this forward (again). I suppose we need to add York's move and SNC move in here.


Provisional Pipeline for 2018-2019
First year full members: Alfred State, Illinois Tech, Iowa Wesleyan, McMurry (reclassifying)
*4th year provisional members: Belhaven
*3rd year provisional members: none
2nd year provisional members: Brevard, Dean, Pfeiffer
1st year provisional members: SUNY-Delhi, Johnson and Wales (Col.)
Exploratory: Pratt, University of St Thomas (TX), Mississippi University for Women.
*Games against Year 3 and 4 provisional members count the same as games against full-members for regional-ranking and tournament selection purposes

Conference Changes Starting in 2019-2020
Alfred State leaves the ACAA for the AMCC
Benedictine leaves D3 for D2
Frostburg State leaves D3 for D2
Manhattanville leaves the MACF for the SKY
New Rochelle (IND) closes
Newbury (NECC) closes
Penn State-Harrisburg leaves the CAC for a return to the NEAC
Southern Vermont (NECC) closes
Staten Island leaves D3 for D2 (plays full D3 schedule. Not eligible for post-season)
Stevens leaves the E8 for the MACF
St. Elizabeth leaves the NEAC for the CSAC
SUNY-Delhi joins the NAC
Texas-Tyler leaves D3 for D2
Thomas More possibly leaves D3 for the NAIA

Provisional Pipeline for 2019-2020
First year full members: (presume Belhaven)
*4th year provisional members: (presume none)
*3rd year provisional members:  (presume Brevard, Dean, Pfeiffer)
2nd year provisional members: (presume SUNY-Delhi, Johnson and Wales (Col.))
1st year provisional members: Pratt, University of St Thomas (TX), Mississippi University for Women.
Exploratory: Bob Jones, Lindenwood-Belleville, Warren Wilson
*Games against Year 3 and 4 provisional members count the same as games against full-members for regional-ranking and tournament selection purposes

Conference Changes Starting in 2020-2021
Keuka leaves the NEAC for the E8
SNC moving from the MWC to the NACC
York PA moving from the CAC to the MAC Commonwealth

[Caz Bombers]

York is going to the MACC not the MACF I believe, and the Staten Island notation should probably go under 2020-21. Next year they're playing a full CUNYAC schedule, they're just not postseason eligible - same path UT Tyler is on this year IIRC.

[Ralph Turner]

York is going to the MACC not the MACF I believe, and the Staten Island notation should probably go under 2020-21. Next year they're playing a full CUNYAC schedule, they're just not postseason eligible - same path UT Tyler is on this year IIRC.

Done. +1!
https://www.d3sports.com/notables/2019/04/york-latest-to-leave-cac

Thanks to Greek for moving it forward. +1!

[Greek Tragedy]

Thanks Caz. Edited.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

York is going to the MACC not the MACF I believe, and the Staten Island notation should probably go under 2020-21. Next year they're playing a full CUNYAC schedule, they're just not postseason eligible - same path UT Tyler is on this year IIRC.

Um ... Staten Island is apparently leaving immediately (if accepted). They will honor their schedules next year, but as their press release said, "effective for the 2019-20 athletic year." They will start the three-year provisional status this upcoming year. UT-Tyler took a year and starts their provisional three-year status this year as well (as I understand it): https://csidolphins.com/news/2019/3/1/general-csi-announces-intention-of-reclassification-to-ncaa-division-ii.aspx.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

York is going to the MACC not the MACF I believe, and the Staten Island notation should probably go under 2020-21. Next year they're playing a full CUNYAC schedule, they're just not postseason eligible - same path UT Tyler is on this year IIRC.

Um ... Staten Island is apparently leaving immediately (if accepted). They will honor their schedules next year, but as their press release said, "effective for the 2019-20 athletic year." They will start the three-year provisional status this upcoming year. UT-Tyler took a year and starts their provisional three-year status this year as well (as I understand it): https://csidolphins.com/news/2019/3/1/general-csi-announces-intention-of-reclassification-to-ncaa-division-ii.aspx.

CSI will be leaving immediately, if accepted, but they are (last I heard) still planning to fulfill their CUNYAC obligations for next season.

[Inkblot]

Um ... Staten Island is apparently leaving immediately (if accepted). They will honor their schedules next year, but as their press release said, "effective for the 2019-20 athletic year." They will start the three-year provisional status this upcoming year. UT-Tyler took a year and starts their provisional three-year status this year as well (as I understand it): https://csidolphins.com/news/2019/3/1/general-csi-announces-intention-of-reclassification-to-ncaa-division-ii.aspx.

UT Tyler will be entering the second year of the three-year provisional D2 process this fall. Frostburg State and Staten Island, if approved, will enter year one. I gather that provisional D2 members aren't required to play a D2 schedule until year two.