Conference changes

[Gregory Sager]

In addition, the word count on that post was only 2,332.  When you run this through Massey's secret formula, it translates into .532278 Sager units.  Gregory's replies typically extend to at least 3.14 Sager units as he runs circles around the original poster's logic.

Unfortunately, we also can't round this up and give credit for one Sager unit.  Everyone knows that Sager units are not rounded up, but rather carried out to the sixth decimal place (unless we are discussing Paradisio Dante, in which case they are carried out to nine decimals).

I have no doubt that in the past, Sager has typed a message and when he hit "post" there was an error because he exceeded the character limit.

In addition, the word count on that post was only 2,332.  When you run this through Massey's secret formula, it translates into .532278 Sager units.  Gregory's replies typically extend to at least 3.14 Sager units as he runs circles around the original poster's logic.

Unfortunately, we also can't round this up and give credit for one Sager unit.  Everyone knows that Sager units are not rounded up, but rather carried out to the sixth decimal place (unless we are discussing Paradisio Dante, in which case they are carried out to nine decimals).

Consulting the Official Handbook, they may be taken out to 6 or to 9 decimals. However Sager units are like Pool B and Pool C bids. They are truncated to the integer.
He gets a "0".   

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Lancaster Bible is getting a little closer to an announcement regarding their departure from the NEAC.

So as I was saying ...

If Morrisville can find a dance partner, St. Mary's can quickly back out and if there aren't any other PSU schools looking to move (not the whole group.........just one or two to allow the NEAC to survive for now), this could be the end of the NEAC.

Not sure where Morrisville goes, to be honest. I know the NAC would have been happy to have them, from what I was told (and it probably isn't much of a secret) the other SUNY's joining the NAC from the NEAC were NOT interested in having Morrisville be part of the package. Part of the reason they were leaving the NEAC was to get away from Morrisville (a slight version of Salisbury in comparison). So, where would Morrisville even go? Maybe the CAC? That isn't necessarily better than the NEAC in terms to scheduling and the like.

And what PSU schools would move? I said when PSU-Harrisburg left the CAC for the NEAC that the move made little sense for a lot of reasons (including improving their programs and now stepping from an ultra-competitive conference to the bottom of the heap). But there really aren't any other PSU's to consider at this point. They certainly aren't coming from the AMCC. PSU-Behrend is in Erie, so they are not helpful to the NEAC. PSU-Altoona is close, but why leave the AMCC for the NEAC? (Then again, why leave the CAC for the NEAC, Harrisburg?!

I think Morrisville is a bit hung out to dry right now. They are surrounded by conferences that are private-only other than the SUNYAC and I don't see any reason for the SUNYAC an 11th - not at least without having a 12th. It is possible, but there is a reason Morrisville hasn't been in the SUNYAC already.

And not sure what SMC may be thinking at this point. I repeat what I have said often: I don't think they really thought this move through. I think they saw a boat in the water they thought was a rescue from what seemed like the sinking CAC and in reality they got on a drifting boat that is now rudderless and without engine power. All while the CAC appears to be fixing their problems and making it to port. (I do realize the CAC commissioner is leaving, but I don't think that means anything in the grand scheme; the ACAA commissioner is still there and it means one less tough decision to be made.)

Anyway ... my two cents on a random Thursday during quarantine and D3 Week.

[Inkblot]

Looks like both NVU campuses (Johnson and Lyndon) might be closing:

https://www.vpr.org/post/vermont-state-colleges-propose-closing-northern-vermont-university-randolph-campus

[Caz Bombers]

Looks like both NVU campuses (Johnson and Lyndon) might be closing:

https://www.vpr.org/post/vermont-state-colleges-propose-closing-northern-vermont-university-randolph-campus

Sad to hear. Good thing the NAC is bringing in those upstate NY ex-NEAC schools, they are now needed to preserve Pool A bids.

Sounds like Castleton will be bolstered by acquiring Johnson's and Lyndon's resources. I think they should re-brand themselves not too far down the line as Vermont State University.

[Ralph Turner]

Just curious and need some insight in the Northeast and East Regions...

Which conferences might be left 5 years from now?

Might we see some mergers?

NECC?
NEAC?
NAC?

[Ralph Turner]

Moved up...

Provisional Pipeline for 2019-2020
First year full members: Belhaven (confirmed)
*4th year provisional members: Brevard (confirmed), Dean (confirmed), Pfeiffer (confirmed)
*3rd year provisional members:  None
2nd year provisional members: SUNY Delhi, Johnson and Wales (Col.) (confirmed)
1st year provisional members: Pratt, University of St Thomas (TX), Mississippi University for Women.
Exploratory: Bob Jones, Warren Wilson
*Games against Year 3 and 4 provisional members count the same as games against full-members for regional-ranking and tournament selection purposes

MacMurray, IL (SLAIC) closes its doors.
Northern Vermont University - Lyndon and Johnson campuses (NAC) closing the doors.

Conference Changes Starting in 2020-2021
Arcadia shifts from the MAC Commonwealth to the MAC Freedom
Cazenovia leaves the NEAC for the NAC
Eastern shifts from the MAC Freedom to the MAC Commonwealth
Dean leaves the NECC for the GNAC
Franciscan leaves the AMCC for the Presidents' Athletic Conference
Keuka leaves the NEAC for the E8
Lycoming shifts from the MAC Commonwealth to the MAC Freedom
Suffolk leaves the GNAC for the CCC
SUNY Cobleskill leaves the NEAC for the NAC
SUNY Delhi leaves the ACAA for the NAC
SUNY Poly leaves the NEAC for the NAC
Valley Forge leaves the ACAA for the CSAC
York (Pa.) leaves the CAC for the MAC Commonwealth

Conference Changes Starting in 2021-2022
Mary Baldwin will add men's program, begin play in the USA South (tentative)
Southern Virginia leaves the CAC for the USA South
St. Mary's (MD) leaves the CAC for the NEAC
St. Norbert leaves the MWC for the NACC
St. Thomas involuntarily removed from MIAC, will go to
-----

Corrections appreciated.

[Pat Coleman]

Vermont has only proposed closing those campuses so far, so I would say it's premature to list them here, even if only by 48 hours.

[Greek Tragedy]

Just curious and need some insight in the Northeast and East Regions...

Which conferences might be left 5 years from now?

Might we see some mergers?

NECC?
NEAC?
NAC?

The NAC is getting bigger, not smaller. They're up to 12 now (10 if the Vermont campuses close).

[Pat Coleman]

Current stance, pending a possible update on Monday:

Provisional Pipeline for 2019-2020
First year full members: Belhaven (confirmed)
*4th year provisional members: Brevard (confirmed), Dean (confirmed), Pfeiffer (confirmed)
*3rd year provisional members:  None
2nd year provisional members: SUNY Delhi, Johnson and Wales (Colo.) (confirmed)
1st year provisional members: Pratt, University of St Thomas (Texas), Mississippi University for Women.
Exploratory: Bob Jones, Warren Wilson
*Games against Year 3 and 4 provisional members count the same as games against full-members for regional-ranking and tournament selection purposes

MacMurray closes its doors.

Conference Changes Starting in 2020-2021
Arcadia shifts from the MAC Commonwealth to the MAC Freedom
Cazenovia leaves the NEAC for the NAC
Eastern shifts from the MAC Freedom to the MAC Commonwealth
Dean leaves the NECC for the GNAC
Franciscan leaves the AMCC for the Presidents' Athletic Conference
Keuka leaves the NEAC for the E8
Lycoming shifts from the MAC Commonwealth to the MAC Freedom
Suffolk leaves the GNAC for the CCC
SUNY Cobleskill leaves the NEAC for the NAC
SUNY Delhi leaves the ACAA for the NAC
SUNY Poly leaves the NEAC for the NAC
Valley Forge leaves the ACAA for the CSAC
York (Pa.) leaves the CAC for the MAC Commonwealth

Conference Changes Starting in 2021-2022
Mary Baldwin will add men's program, begin play in the USA South (tentative)
Southern Virginia leaves the CAC for the USA South
St. Mary's (Md.) leaves the CAC for the NEAC
St. Norbert leaves the MWC for the NACC
St. Thomas involuntarily removed from MIAC, will go to

[Inkblot]

If the NVU campuses indeed close, that leaves the NAC with five New York schools and five Maine schools, with a gap of 300 miles between the two groups.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

If the NVU campuses indeed close, that leaves the NAC with five New York schools and five Maine schools, with a gap of 300 miles between the two groups.

The entire plan was to split into divisions. If Vermont schools do indeed shutdown (pending the vote Monday), then the 5 and 5 is unfortunate, but not the end of the world. First, they could still go with an off-set schedule. Second, many of the schools were already going with the travel - next year would have been the first chance, I believe, they could have gone to the divisions. Third, there will likely be other schools that could join the NAC (due to further closings in New England and/or other schools possibly joining DIII) to help bolster the numbers.

No ... losing the Vermonts will not be helpful and will forgo years of work, but also not the end of the world. There are conferences in this country that would look at 300 miles and laugh at how short that distance is.

[Pat Coleman]

If the NVU campuses indeed close, that leaves the NAC with five New York schools and five Maine schools, with a gap of 300 miles between the two groups.

The entire plan was to split into divisions. If Vermont schools do indeed shutdown (pending the vote Monday), then the 5 and 5 is unfortunate, but not the end of the world. First, they could still go with an off-set schedule. Second, many of the schools were already going with the travel - next year would have been the first chance, I believe, they could have gone to the divisions. Third, there will likely be other schools that could join the NAC (due to further closings in New England and/or other schools possibly joining DIII) to help bolster the numbers.

No ... losing the Vermonts will not be helpful and will forgo years of work, but also not the end of the world. There are conferences in this country that would look at 300 miles and laugh at how short that distance is.

This is true, but 300 miles in that part of the world in the winter is a lot different than 300 flat miles on I-20.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Not all those comparisons are in Texas. SUNYAC has some pretty narly travel. Longest trip in the MIAC is above that mileage. Trips in the ARC, especially to Neb. Wesleyan are long in some brutal winter weather. The NWC trips to both Whits are further than 300 miles. Even the NEAC has some far-flung travel (even when the current members leave). I am sure there may be others if I continue looking.

My point ... conferences have both been getting closer and getting further away. 300 miles isn't out of the norm. It is part of the life of a lot of conferences even in what is usually tough winter places.

[Pat Coleman]

Thanks for telling me about Minnesota. I hadn't heard!

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

The NAC has been doing weekend trips every other year for the far-flung schools.  You get back to back home games every other year.  Not sure how that'll change with divisions or if they postpone going to divisions.  The trouble they've had is there really isn't an east East-West corridor in Northern New England - you generally have to go down to the Mass Pike and then back up again.

Not having the Vermont schools might actually make it easier.

I do wonder how the NECC will factor in.  They seem to have trouble keeping seven teams in business.