WBB: NESCAC

[amh63]

NHNESCACFan.....Thanks you for the description.  Owe you and yours a dinner sometime...maybe durning a conference tournament period.  Yes, students in my days do "drop" out and end up in different classes eventually....maybe because of money, grades or just not attending the required number of "chapel" meetings.  Any case, you have indeed aroused my curiosity....not standard issued garb.  Need to ask for his tailor.  Watch the games on-line.

[NH NESCAC Fan]

OK...new topic for discussion.  Twelve games into the season I just went to the NCAA website to look at stats, and it is very interesting to me.  Amherst, because of their depth in large part, plays their starters roughly half of every game, minutes wise.  Consequently, when you look at the individual statistics you are hard pressed to find any statistical leaders from Amherst.  When you look at the team statistics, however, Amherst dominates.  This clearly, to me, highlights the importance of the team over the individual...but what does it mean at the end of the season when it comes time for the individual accolades?  There was some discussion earlier on this board about whether Caroline Stedman should be on the pre-season All America team based on her statistics.  If you've seen her play you have no doubt of her talent, but if you go strictly by stats you would never know she existed (exaggeration).

So, I guess it is a testament, in my mind, to the players who are willing to give up the individual glory for the team accomplishments.  It would be nice if they could have their cake and eat it too, but it rarely works out that way.

[Roundball999]

OK...new topic for discussion.  Twelve games into the season I just went to the NCAA website to look at stats, and it is very interesting to me.  Amherst, because of their depth in large part, plays their starters roughly half of every game, minutes wise.  Consequently, when you look at the individual statistics you are hard pressed to find any statistical leaders from Amherst.  When you look at the team statistics, however, Amherst dominates.  This clearly, to me, highlights the importance of the team over the individual...but what does it mean at the end of the season when it comes time for the individual accolades?  There was some discussion earlier on this board about whether Caroline Stedman should be on the pre-season All America team based on her statistics.  If you've seen her play you have no doubt of her talent, but if you go strictly by stats you would never know she existed (exaggeration).

So, I guess it is a testament, in my mind, to the players who are willing to give up the individual glory for the team accomplishments.  It would be nice if they could have their cake and eat it too, but it rarely works out that way.

That's a really excellent point.  It's exacerbated at the D3 level because even the top players often aren't seen by a broad audience, so statistics are even more relied upon for individual accolades.  No easy solutions though....

[BBstudent]

Continuing on with that thought, it is always interesting to watch the NESCAC statistical leaders who, at the beginning of the season, can put up 18 points, 8 rebounds and 6 assists (hypothetically) until they start conference play against Bowdoin, Amherst and sometimes Tufts or Williams. Once conference play starts the numbers become more realistic. Conversely, now that conference play is starting, based on previous years experience, you will see the stats for the Amherst girls go up as the starters minutes rise from about 20-23 minutes a game to 27-32 minutes a game.
But, as you said, it is a team game and a testament to the girls that they each give up some individual glory so that as a team they can be as outstanding as possible.

[amh63]

Interesting topic of individual glory versus team glory in essence.  The Wash. Post today had a quote from a top columnist with regards to the Washington Wizards. the local NBA team that remains winless.....it basically states that the team is made up of very selfish players that for the most part puts individual glory over team wins.  The pros are about money and individual stats lead to money.  Still the players like to win and do not like to be on a losing team.
At the college level at least and for the most part in Div.3, winning is the important thing, I believe.  Early in the season, players learn to work together and often become role players for the good of the team.  The season can turn when a key player gets hurt, lost, or is ill. When a team is built around a few players, winning becomes harder when they are defended well and/or have off-days....and they will have bad days.  Top teams recruit to have depth and develop players to be able to be team players, etc.  In the end, the team wants to win games and to win championships....conference and even national ones if possible.  Amherst gets players that want to play for Coach G., a winning coach.  They get talented players that want to win and be on a team that has a chance to win a national title.  Ask the players on the team and I'm sure they put the team first and their stats second.  Oh yes, they like their National title rings.

[sumfun]

They LOVE those rings, and TEAM has taken precedent over individual stats in the Gromacki era.  Part of that is G.P., part is the team leadership, and part is team chemistry.  Having said that, Amherst has gotten it's due at season end....Jaci as D3 Player of the Year over Christopher Newport's Schweer (sp?), Stedman as MVP of the tourney and All-American the year before, Leyman - NCAA record for most games played in a career.  Stedman's numbers were down last year due to mid season injury, but she more than made up for it when it counted in the Final Four.  BBStudent is spot on when saying that Amherst individual stats don't rise until NESCAC games, and still might not rise to the very top, but as a team, usually in top 3 in most categories.

[amh63]

Amherst plays Farmington State away tonight.  No webcast.  One of the few out of conference games remaining on the schedule.
Returning to the topic brought up by NH...Fan.
In the tournament over the holidays in Vegas, Amherst blew out several teams.  In one of them, Lem Atanga McCormick...a senior starter was brought back in late in the game.  It puzzled me...though I am often confused.  Lem was aggressive in her scoring attempts.  She hits an outside shot and the Amherst Bench all rise up clapping and shouting.  Lem had scored her 1000th point and goes into the Amherst record book.  It seems that in spite of team goals, etc., the coach and her team are aware of stats that are important to individuals....and the team enjoy sharing those goals.

[BBstudent]

With respect to Lem's late return, I don't know that you are correct as to the reason but I also don't know if your speculation is incorrect. I think this early in the season the coach is more interested in trying out combinations and forcing new players to work with returning players. So, for instance, Caroline and Shannon were inserted back in the line up fairly late in the Farmingdale game playing with some of the non-starters. This might be considered "garbage time" in other programs but I think with this team whenever one is playing it is for a reason and part of a plan which may not be apparent at least to me. It may be to keep people from being hurt, or to keep players fresh for the next game or to see how the team might function if someone later is injured (bite my tongue) or can't play in a game because of foul trouble.
I may be wrong (or could change that to I usually am wrong) but I doubt if the coach realized that Lem was so close to 1000 points, especially since the season is just starting and she was not in danger of missing that milestone during the year.

[daoustian]

Another Amherst recruit for the class of 2016 -- we'll see whether soccer or basketball win out.
http://buckhead.patch.com/articles/pace-seniors-make-college-commitments

[amh63]

BBstudent....Good points all.  Your "handle" is most appropriate.  I was traveling yesterday and did not report on the long island NY game.  Still puzzled about this game....did last year too.  Guess it is to prepare the team for a long day trip game while school /classes are still out.
Thanks Doust.... for the info.  Like Spencer Noon, the new recruit will play both sports awhile until injuries or something else requires only one.  Amherst senior Rizzo plays both now.  In any case, the point guard position is critical for the future.  The recruits for this year are front court players.

[amh63]

Forgot to say that I'm excited to see my first live game in LeFrak this year.  It is always fun to be up close and watch the team play.  The game against Hamilton will be interesting.  I'm sure Coach G. remembers recruiting point guard Finucane at Courtland NY....or becoming aware of her......when he was the coach at Hamilton.

[ephoops]

Question for the followers of Amherst WBB:

What is Gromacki's reputation on campus?  His on-court success speaks for itself.  Do the girls love playing for him?

The reason I ask is that the Bucknell women's job just opened up.  Apparently the coach who just resigned was a vilified by her former players and former assistant coaches.  There was an uprising on the Bucknell hoops internet message board this past week which culminated in the coach's resignation late this evening.  See the link below:

http://www.boards.basketball-u.com/showforum.php?fid/53/

With the success that Dave Paulsen has had coaching the Bucknell men's b-ball team, Gromacki may be a candidate for the Bucknell women's job at season's end...

[amh63]

Amherst beats Hamilton 78-25 last night, holding the visitors to their lowest score of the season.  The visitors came into the game with a rep. for holding opponents to around 43 points/game.  Amherst had that many points and more at half time.  Detail writeup of the game on the Amherst website.  Amherst did change their rotation of players a bit last night....bringing new players in groups of five,  Hamilton just doesn't have the players or the depth to match Amherst this year...or Amherst's defensive intensity.
To answer the EPHoops' posted question......Not at this time, IMO.

[sumfun]

The kids respect him and like playing for him, and they know that his game prep will win them games.  I can't imagine that if he wasn't interested in the UMass job that he'd be willing to go to Bucknell.  I don't think he really likes the flying and travel involved in D1, but that's just a guess.

[BBstudent]

I am not sure that is the correct tack to take in this situation. Instead of telling everyone how much the players like and respect him, which is obvious from their play, maybe we should make everyone think the opposite so he has to stay at Amherst. For example, we could say that it was really Gromacki, not Woody Hayes, who hit the Clemson player in 1978; and we could hint that it was the Amherst girls' basketball coach that suggested to Belichick the idea of stealing other teams signals... We could even hire some political consultant to run a dirty tricks campaign so no one will hire him.  For my money the less people know about what a great coach and person he is, the better off we are.