WBB: Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Franklin cruises 63-35 over Earlham and will face Hanover on Friday at Transy. Panthers won by 12 and 6 this year.
Bluffton scored just 1 point in the first 9 1/2 minutes of the 4th but held on to beat Anderson 47-41. They'll face Transylvania. Pioneers won by 20 and 14 this season.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Women's third regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/women-regional-rankings-third

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

[Enginerd]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

Transy needs to win the HCAC Tournament.  If they don't, they need to hope that Baldwin Wallace wins the OAC and Ohio Northern and John Carroll both lose early in the OAC Tournament (which IS typically a bloodbath). Having no games vs. RRO's would be a killer with three losses and an anemic NCAA #, with two OAC schools with multiple games vs. RRO's and big NCAA #'s sitting right behind them in the regional rankings.

Here's the problem. Transy is MORE than good enough to be an NCAA Tournament team this year, just like RHIT last year and in 2016. RHIT wanted to ensure it wouldn't happen again, so they went out and added Chicago, became the 4th permanent member of the Midwest Classic, and scheduled anyone that would play them, just to try to overcome the perception of the HCAC being a weak conference and the precipitous drop in the NCAA # after conference play - and THEY STILL got left home last season. I'll guarantee you that RHIT was better than Denison in 2016, better than Baldwin-Wallace last year, and Transy is better than anyone in the OAC THIS year, but, as HCAC schools, they need to play virtually a suicidal non-conference schedule just to get the respect than an OAC school does just by showing up for their conference games.

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

Transy needs to win the HCAC Tournament.  If they don't, they need to hope that Baldwin Wallace wins the OAC and Ohio Northern and John Carroll both lose early in the OAC Tournament (which IS typically a bloodbath). Having no games vs. RRO's would be a killer with three losses and an anemic NCAA #, with two OAC schools with multiple games vs. RRO's and big NCAA #'s sitting right behind them in the regional rankings.

Here's the problem. Transy is MORE than good enough to be an NCAA Tournament team this year, just like RHIT last year and in 2016. RHIT wanted to ensure it wouldn't happen again, so they went out and added Chicago, became the 4th permanent member of the Midwest Classic, and scheduled anyone that would play them, just to try to overcome the perception of the HCAC being a weak conference and the precipitous drop in the NCAA # after conference play - and THEY STILL got left home last season. I'll guarantee you that RHIT was better than Denison in 2016, better than Baldwin-Wallace last year, and Transy is better than anyone in the OAC THIS year, but, as HCAC schools, they need to play virtually a suicidal non-conference schedule just to get the respect than an OAC school does just by showing up for their conference games.

Let's assume Transy is pool C... that means they lose in the tournament, ideally in the championship to Hanover. Hanover is now a ranked opponent and they'd be 1-2 which is still better than 0-0.

[Enginerd]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

Transy needs to win the HCAC Tournament.  If they don't, they need to hope that Baldwin Wallace wins the OAC and Ohio Northern and John Carroll both lose early in the OAC Tournament (which IS typically a bloodbath). Having no games vs. RRO's would be a killer with three losses and an anemic NCAA #, with two OAC schools with multiple games vs. RRO's and big NCAA #'s sitting right behind them in the regional rankings.

Here's the problem. Transy is MORE than good enough to be an NCAA Tournament team this year, just like RHIT last year and in 2016. RHIT wanted to ensure it wouldn't happen again, so they went out and added Chicago, became the 4th permanent member of the Midwest Classic, and scheduled anyone that would play them, just to try to overcome the perception of the HCAC being a weak conference and the precipitous drop in the NCAA # after conference play - and THEY STILL got left home last season. I'll guarantee you that RHIT was better than Denison in 2016, better than Baldwin-Wallace last year, and Transy is better than anyone in the OAC THIS year, but, as HCAC schools, they need to play virtually a suicidal non-conference schedule just to get the respect than an OAC school does just by showing up for their conference games.

Let's assume Transy is pool C... that means they lose in the tournament, ideally in the championship to Hanover. Hanover is now a ranked opponent and they'd be 1-2 which is still better than 0-0.

Got this from today's release on the main D3Hoops site - seems to imply that only those teams ranked on the 19th are considered to be RRO's for the purpose of the 4th and final regional ranking? If I'm reading this correctly Transy is 0-0 vs. RRO's, and that ain't changing.

"The third public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 26. They are the last of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 19 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

Transy needs to win the HCAC Tournament.  If they don't, they need to hope that Baldwin Wallace wins the OAC and Ohio Northern and John Carroll both lose early in the OAC Tournament (which IS typically a bloodbath). Having no games vs. RRO's would be a killer with three losses and an anemic NCAA #, with two OAC schools with multiple games vs. RRO's and big NCAA #'s sitting right behind them in the regional rankings.

Here's the problem. Transy is MORE than good enough to be an NCAA Tournament team this year, just like RHIT last year and in 2016. RHIT wanted to ensure it wouldn't happen again, so they went out and added Chicago, became the 4th permanent member of the Midwest Classic, and scheduled anyone that would play them, just to try to overcome the perception of the HCAC being a weak conference and the precipitous drop in the NCAA # after conference play - and THEY STILL got left home last season. I'll guarantee you that RHIT was better than Denison in 2016, better than Baldwin-Wallace last year, and Transy is better than anyone in the OAC THIS year, but, as HCAC schools, they need to play virtually a suicidal non-conference schedule just to get the respect than an OAC school does just by showing up for their conference games.

Let's assume Transy is pool C... that means they lose in the tournament, ideally in the championship to Hanover. Hanover is now a ranked opponent and they'd be 1-2 which is still better than 0-0.

Got this from today's release on the main D3Hoops site - seems to imply that only those teams ranked on the 19th are considered to be RRO's for the purpose of the 4th and final regional ranking? If I'm reading this correctly Transy is 0-0 vs. RRO's, and that ain't changing.

"The third public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 26. They are the last of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 19 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

That line should be in a separate paragraph. "This ranking uses the Feb 19..." is referring to the latest rankings using the ranked teams from the Feb 19th rankings. Here's the same paragraph from the previous rankings

The second public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 19. They are the middle of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 12 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

[Baldini]

I think Transylvania will bump back ahead of Trine in the final rankings, but I don't have a good feeling about them hosting the first weekend. If they had stayed ahead of Oglethorpe, they may have been the choice to host Berea, William Peace and Oglethorpe. I am now thinking that their is enough teams for Oglethorpe to host.   

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

I think Transylvania will bump back ahead of Trine in the final rankings, but I don't have a good feeling about them hosting the first weekend. If they had stayed ahead of Oglethorpe, they may have been the choice to host Berea, William Peace and Oglethorpe. I am now thinking that their is enough teams for Oglethorpe to host.

We'll have to see how they do this week. Trine lost 2 RRO wins with Albion falling out but gained one with Hanover climbing in while Transy picks up a win and loss with Hanover. Trine still has the edge 2-4 to 1-1. Trine also has a fairly significant edge in SoS .555 vs .509 which will grow further based on the conference tourneys. All the Pioneers have in their favor right now is win percentage. Transy didn't just drop because they lost because Trine lost to #1 Hope as well.
If Transy wins the HCAC and Trine loses to Hope in the finals I'm only 50/50 that they'll flip. A Trine loss to Albion in the semis would be a big help.

[Enginerd]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

Transy needs to win the HCAC Tournament.  If they don't, they need to hope that Baldwin Wallace wins the OAC and Ohio Northern and John Carroll both lose early in the OAC Tournament (which IS typically a bloodbath). Having no games vs. RRO's would be a killer with three losses and an anemic NCAA #, with two OAC schools with multiple games vs. RRO's and big NCAA #'s sitting right behind them in the regional rankings.

Here's the problem. Transy is MORE than good enough to be an NCAA Tournament team this year, just like RHIT last year and in 2016. RHIT wanted to ensure it wouldn't happen again, so they went out and added Chicago, became the 4th permanent member of the Midwest Classic, and scheduled anyone that would play them, just to try to overcome the perception of the HCAC being a weak conference and the precipitous drop in the NCAA # after conference play - and THEY STILL got left home last season. I'll guarantee you that RHIT was better than Denison in 2016, better than Baldwin-Wallace last year, and Transy is better than anyone in the OAC THIS year, but, as HCAC schools, they need to play virtually a suicidal non-conference schedule just to get the respect than an OAC school does just by showing up for their conference games.

Let's assume Transy is pool C... that means they lose in the tournament, ideally in the championship to Hanover. Hanover is now a ranked opponent and they'd be 1-2 which is still better than 0-0.

Got this from today's release on the main D3Hoops site - seems to imply that only those teams ranked on the 19th are considered to be RRO's for the purpose of the 4th and final regional ranking? If I'm reading this correctly Transy is 0-0 vs. RRO's, and that ain't changing.

"The third public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 26. They are the last of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 19 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

That line should be in a separate paragraph. "This ranking uses the Feb 19..." is referring to the latest rankings using the ranked teams from the Feb 19th rankings. Here's the same paragraph from the previous rankings

The second public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 19. They are the middle of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 12 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

No - it shouldn't. It was all part of the quote and not my opinion or words.

Guys, much as I'd like to see it happen (because they are really good at home-I think they could have beaten Thomas More at home last year) there is very little chance Transy could possibly host - unless the schools that finish ahead of them haven't put in bids or their men's programs DO put in bids and this year belongs to the men's side for hosting precedence. They aren't leap-frogging DePauw or Hope, or now BW, or likely anyone else at this point, unless Trine loses in a semi-final. Additionally, the NCAA #'s of Ohio Northern and John Carroll will get better playing games in the OAC Tournament. Other than Trine, the only place for them to go in the rankings is down. The absolute best they could do is 4th (5th if Trine upsets Hope), because whomever wins the OAC (unless it's a real dark-horse) will pass Transy. There's no chance they'll finish ahead of Hope, regardless of what happens in the MIAC, and as long as DePauw makes the NCAC finals, the same holds. If Transy wins the HCAC, they will finish behind DePauw, Hope, and whomever wins the OAC, and if Transy finishes 4th or 5th in their region with ZERO games vs. RRO's, there will be some extraordinarily upset folks, and they'll have a legitimate argument, if they are chosen to host.

If they don't win the HCAC, they would be in serious jeopardy of not getting in at all without any games vs. RRO's, which, to my knowledge, have not been factors thus far in the first three rankings, but will be an important criteria for the final one.

I'm telling you, Transy is as good as anyone in the Great Lakes region except Hope - but as I've said, any HCAC team that wants to be treated like other, more prominent programs at the end of the year, really need to go out and schedule some of the better OAC and UAA teams, and not rely on the old venus fly-trap strategy of only getting quality opponents when they'll come play in one of your events (if you think I'm picking on Transy, I'm not, the only quality non-conference team I remember Bluffton playing during their 2015-18 run was when St. Thomas came and played in their event) or accidentally bump into a quality team at someone else's event.

I'll bet they get sent to Ogelthorpe - either as a conference champion in the #2 slot or as an at-large in the #3 spot. It really might make very little difference HOW they get in. If it's Oglethorpe, they REALLY match-up well with them and could very well advance out of the first weekend - they just need to GET to the first weekend.

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Transy fell to 5th in the regional rankings and Hanover makes an appearance at 9th.

Transy needs to win the HCAC Tournament.  If they don't, they need to hope that Baldwin Wallace wins the OAC and Ohio Northern and John Carroll both lose early in the OAC Tournament (which IS typically a bloodbath). Having no games vs. RRO's would be a killer with three losses and an anemic NCAA #, with two OAC schools with multiple games vs. RRO's and big NCAA #'s sitting right behind them in the regional rankings.

Here's the problem. Transy is MORE than good enough to be an NCAA Tournament team this year, just like RHIT last year and in 2016. RHIT wanted to ensure it wouldn't happen again, so they went out and added Chicago, became the 4th permanent member of the Midwest Classic, and scheduled anyone that would play them, just to try to overcome the perception of the HCAC being a weak conference and the precipitous drop in the NCAA # after conference play - and THEY STILL got left home last season. I'll guarantee you that RHIT was better than Denison in 2016, better than Baldwin-Wallace last year, and Transy is better than anyone in the OAC THIS year, but, as HCAC schools, they need to play virtually a suicidal non-conference schedule just to get the respect than an OAC school does just by showing up for their conference games.

Let's assume Transy is pool C... that means they lose in the tournament, ideally in the championship to Hanover. Hanover is now a ranked opponent and they'd be 1-2 which is still better than 0-0.

Got this from today's release on the main D3Hoops site - seems to imply that only those teams ranked on the 19th are considered to be RRO's for the purpose of the 4th and final regional ranking? If I'm reading this correctly Transy is 0-0 vs. RRO's, and that ain't changing.

"The third public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 26. They are the last of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 19 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

That line should be in a separate paragraph. "This ranking uses the Feb 19..." is referring to the latest rankings using the ranked teams from the Feb 19th rankings. Here's the same paragraph from the previous rankings

The second public NCAA Division III regional rankings were released on Feb. 19. They are the middle of three sets which we will see before the selections are made and announced on Monday, March 2. There is also one final set of regional rankings, which is released after the tournament bracket is revealed. This ranking uses the Feb. 12 regional rankings to determine which teams qualify as "results vs. regionally ranked opponents."

No - it shouldn't. It was all part of the quote and not my opinion or words.

Guys, much as I'd like to see it happen (because they are really good at home-I think they could have beaten Thomas More at home last year) there is very little chance Transy could possibly host - unless the schools that finish ahead of them haven't put in bids or their men's programs DO put in bids and this year belongs to the men's side for hosting precedence. They aren't leap-frogging DePauw or Hope, or now BW, or likely anyone else at this point, unless Trine loses in a semi-final. Additionally, the NCAA #'s of Ohio Northern and John Carroll will get better playing games in the OAC Tournament. Other than Trine, the only place for them to go in the rankings is down. The absolute best they could do is 4th (5th if Trine upsets Hope), because whomever wins the OAC (unless it's a real dark-horse) will pass Transy. There's no chance they'll finish ahead of Hope, regardless of what happens in the MIAC, and as long as DePauw makes the NCAC finals, the same holds. If Transy wins the HCAC, they will finish behind DePauw, Hope, and whomever wins the OAC, and if Transy finishes 4th or 5th in their region with ZERO games vs. RRO's, there will be some extraordinarily upset folks, and they'll have a legitimate argument, if they are chosen to host.

If they don't win the HCAC, they would be in serious jeopardy of not getting in at all without any games vs. RRO's, which, to my knowledge, have not been factors thus far in the first three rankings, but will be an important criteria for the final one.

I'm telling you, Transy is as good as anyone in the Great Lakes region except Hope - but as I've said, any HCAC team that wants to be treated like other, more prominent programs at the end of the year, really need to go out and schedule some of the better OAC and UAA teams, and not rely on the old venus fly-trap strategy of only getting quality opponents when they'll come play in one of your events (if you think I'm picking on Transy, I'm not, the only quality non-conference team I remember Bluffton playing during their 2015-18 run was when St. Thomas came and played in their event) or accidentally bump into a quality team at someone else's event.

I'll bet they get sent to Ogelthorpe - either as a conference champion in the #2 slot or as an at-large in the #3 spot. It really might make very little difference HOW they get in. If it's Oglethorpe, they REALLY match-up well with them and could very well advance out of the first weekend - they just need to GET to the first weekend.

I wasn't saying you didn't put it in a different paragraph, I'm saying when they posted the rankings it should have been. They did the same thing in the 2nd rankings as I quoted. It does make it seem like they're saying the final rankings uses the Feb 19th or Feb 12 rankings to determine RRO but it just refers to that specific ranking using the previous week's ranked teams to determine RRO for that week. Transylvania will have a 1-1 RRO when they make the 4th rankings.
They need to hope Hanover beats Franklin though. If they beat Hanover then they're automatically in, if they lose, at least Hanover should stay in the rankings to keep that 1 RRO win.

[Baldini]

If I had to wager a guess I would say it is very unlikely that Transylvania is selected to host, but geography plays a big part in it at the D3 level and because of their location I still think their is a small chance. The catch to them hosting would be that it would end up being a loaded bracket for them with one of the island powers as a first weekend matchup. Their best chance to advance from the 1st weekend might be a trip to Atlanta.   

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

Transy and Hanover complete their domination of the conference. A combined 34-0 this year against the other 8 teams. Early 11:30am tip for the title tomorrow.

[Enginerd]

I think Transy will destroy the field at the HCAC Tournament - so any discussion about whether they deserve an at-large bid is moot. They'll likely get a winnable 1st round game, too. Will be interesting to see where they get sent. My way-too-early prognostication is Oglethorpe - and I wouldn't be surprised if they managed another Sweet 16 appearance - depending on the match-ups with the other two teams in that pod.

Told you so.

Just remains to be seen where they get sent. I'll bet they go to either DePauw/Baldwin Wallace (whichever winds up #2 in the region) or Oglethorpe. They should get a manageable #2 vs. #3 game if they are sent South - Potential match-ups at Oglethorpe might be Randolph-Macon, Emory, Emory and Henry, William Peace, or even Piedmont if they beat Berea today - Berea might show up at the same pod, but I think the NCAA tries to avoid first-round match-ups of teams that played each other during the regular season. Likely opponents if they stay in the Great Lakes could be IL. Wesleyan, Wheaton, Trine, or one of the OAC schools. Surely they wouldn't be sent to Texas.

There might be too many southeastern/eastern teams for Transy to go to Oglethorpe - in which case they'd almost certainly have to be sent to DePauw/Baldwin Wallace, Hope, or Chicago.

They ought to leap-frog Trine in the final regional standings since they are a conference champion and Trine is not - which usually means a better #2-#3 match-up somewhere. RHIT's tournament title in 2018 meant a winnable pod with Wisc.-Whitewater and Gustavus Adolphus instead of the "pod of death" at IL. Wesleyan with DePauw, the Titans, and a pretty damn good Marietta team, which is where Trine was sent. The committee clearly placed some value on being a conference champion and this might be to Transy's benefit - despite their poor SOS and lack of any meaningful games vs. RRO's.

They'd have a far more manageable draw if they were to be sent to Atlanta - anywhere in the Great Lakes is almost certainly going to be that "pod of death".

[Enginerd]

Congrats to Transy! They again have a very do-able draw and should be pretty thrilled with it. They might still be playing in two weeks.

Having said that - WOW - Transy getting to host is a perfect example of what the two primary driving factors behind how the D3 field is chosen must be - money and convenience - because it is otherwise impossible to defend having a team with an NCAA # barely above .500 and ZERO wins vs. RRO's (if Hanover drops out of the final GL rankings) host an NCAA Tournament pod.

Again, I am happy for Transy, I'm a fan for the next week or longer, but  Good Lord...