MBB: University Athletic Association

[HopeConvert]

Q: could very well be. I'm just not familiar enough with all the teams to judge. I will say this - this year's Hope team is better than last year's, and they barely lost to WashU with a healthy Wallis in the elite 8. I know it is hard to compare across years, but it is essentially the same Bears club. In my opinion, this year's iteration of the Dutchmen is not just marginally better, I think they are significantly better, even without Steve Cramer. The difference results from a number of intangibles, including the way a number of the players have progressed, but mostly from the presence of Ryan Klein, who is as good a defensive player as I have seen (ask Kent Raymond). Klein has the length and athleticism to hang with Nading, and I'd be surprised if Nading has had to deal this year with anyone like Ryan. I suspect we'll see VanderHeide and Osburn spend time on Ruths. I don't know who to favor in this year's final four - Amherst looks awfully strong to me - but I will say I like Hope's odds against WashU better this year than I did last year.

I look at it this way, Hope.  Without Wallis, Wash U finished just one game out of first in the power-packed UAA this season.  In the tournament, they knocked off a very good Wooser team on a neutral court, won at CCIW champion Augustana (a very good team that rarely loses at home), beat a Buena Vista squad that was on par with all of the top teams I've seen this year, and knocked off Millsaps - the most athletic team I have seen in '07-08.  I am 100% sure that Wash U would be significantly better with their All-American point-guard.  That improvement would seem, to me, to put the Bears a notch above the pack.  But they don't have Wallis, so the point is moot anyway.

The Hope/Wash U game should be a classic.

On the other hand (I can't believe I'm bringing this up again), the Bears did lose, with Wallis in the lineup, to a Calvin team that was handled pretty well by the Dutchmen this year. That said, I agree that WashU would be better with Wallis in the lineup, and would be the prohibitive favorite going to Salem. I also agree that the Hope/WashU game should be a great, close game. I don't know if Hope is better than WashU, but they did just beat a CCIW team that also beat Augie, by 13, and this with one starter fighting through the flu, and another with an extremely sore knee.

I wonder if part of the issue isn't this: while I agree with what you and Greg have said about the power of a conference being contingent on the strength of the teams top to bottom, I wonder if the MIAA champs might not be given full credit because of the weakness of the bottom half of the league. I know that sounds silly to say, given that Hope is ranked #1, but unless I've missed it, I haven't read anyone on CCIW or UAA boards indicate that they think Hope is a team to be feared.

Just spitballing. I look forward to hearing what you think about that.

[Titan Q]

I know that sounds silly to say, given that Hope is ranked #1, but unless I've missed it, I haven't read anyone on CCIW or UAA boards indicate that they think Hope is a team to be feared.

Yes, that does sound a bit silly to be honest.  Absolutely no one on these boards (that I recall) has disrespected Hope in any fashion.  I think you're reaching here. 

[HopeConvert]

I know that sounds silly to say, given that Hope is ranked #1, but unless I've missed it, I haven't read anyone on CCIW or UAA boards indicate that they think Hope is a team to be feared.

Yes, that does sound a bit silly to be honest.  Absolutely no one on these boards (that I recall) has disrespected Hope in any fashion.  I think you're reaching here. 

Fair enough. I don't think Hope has been disrespected. I guess my objection is to the claim that, with Wallis, WashU would be "head and shoulders" above everyone else. I'm not convinced, for the reasons I've outlined above. And that's what makes me think that people aren't seeing this Hope team for what it is. That said, WashU could very well win on Friday and prove me wrong.

[OxyFan21]

Last night was only my 2nd time seeing Wash U this year, so take this as just my uneducated opinion...

As has been noted here by Titan Q, to me, Wash U's only weakness is that #10 doesn't seem quite ready for the intense defense that is likely to be played in Salem.  He just didn't seem to "want" the ball... 

Having read this thread, I know that Wallis has been out, but the point was their glaring weakness last night against that quick Millsaps D, especially when they trapped him.  If they pound it inside like they did in the 2nd half, I don't think many teams will be able to stop them.

Good luck to the Bears.

[quaj]

I've got to say from my personal experience being in the Field House for that game against Millsaps and throughout the year for other men's basketball, women's basketball and volleyball games, it's never been louder. When the Millsaps player messed up the wide open dunk, it was crazy. (Thank you Bomb Squad!)

The numbers were greatly affected by the fact that Wash. U. was on Spring Break. Lots of students hadn't come back yet though a good number did return in time for the game.
Another thing is that some of the biggest supporters of Wash. U. sports are fellow athletes who were all away at other events. Might be small in number but a big momentum boost as the athletes seem to be fairly tight. Our women's track and field team took third place at Nationals and senior Morgen Leonard-Fleckman was crowned national champion. Our softball team won their conference title. Our women's swimming and diving team took sixth at nationals.

If the Bears play like they played in the first seven minutes of the second period against Millsaps where they had a 17-0 run, I'd say they've got a good shot at the entire thing. This time we've got a fan bus and I think  a large number of students will be heading up to support Wash. U. in the Final Four.

Go Bears.

[Marty Peretz]

I've heard 2 fan busses since the demand is high. We won't have as many people as Hope (no one does), but we'll make our presence felt at the Civil Center...and at the local watering holes, I can promise you that.

[fpc85]

I've heard 2 fan busses since the demand is high. We won't have as many people as Hope (no one does), but we'll make our presence felt at the Civil Center...and at the local watering holes, I can promise you that.

the jeff fan base will be small but supportive! walzy what is the over/under for the number of jeff fans in amherst?

[Hugenerd]

Two CMU alumni get snubbed tonight in d1, both coaches for Arizona State.  Head Coach Herb Sendek ('85, who I do not believe played for the Tartans) and Director of Basketball Operations Mike Gibson ('05, who was a four year letterman for the Tartans).  Also, Robert Spence, Technology Coordinator for ASU, is a d3 alumnus (Guilford '04).

[ILive4This]

Yeah that was interesting, ASU beats UA twice but UA gets in and ASU does not, but i guess thats what happens when ASU did not fair as well against the rest of the PAC 10. Anyway what is the connections between CMU and ASU, not usual to see that, especially someone two years out of college as a director of bball operations at a bcs school.

[La Verdad]

the jeff fan base will be small but supportive! walzy what is the over/under for the number of jeff fans in amherst?

I'd bet we get somewhere between 75 and 100...I hope.  There probably won't be more than a handful of students there...stupid spring break.  I'm sure they will be a passionate bunch...I hear we are having a belated St. Patty's day celebration.

I've heard 2 fan busses since the demand is high. We won't have as many people as Hope (no one does), but we'll make our presence felt at the Civil Center...and at the local watering holes, I can promise you that.

Sounds like the all the other schools are going to be rolling deep.  Should make for a great atmosphere in Salem.  It usually turns into a big D3 bball love fest down there...lots of mutual respect for opposing fans and players (especially at the watering holes).  Looking forward to meeting the opposing fans, especially the Wash U crowd.  I kind of jilted coach kinbom (sp?) a few years back and still feel a little guilty about it.

[Marty Peretz]

La Verdad,
we won't be rolling that deep, but we should have some of Kindbom's linebackers in the house and I'll be spending much of the weekend with my good friend Walzy, so I'm sure we'll meet up. First round's on me.

[ILive4This]

Amherst had maybe 100 tops this past weekend only four hours away, and almost no students, I know it was break, and I know this is the final four, but I would be surprised to see that much Amherst support outside of just students. Then again they have it easier than Hope and Wash U. Ursinus should have the easiest time getting there, I hope their students pull through, I would love to see them make their way to the Title Game.

[BUBeaverFan]

Last year's Wash U following was certainly respectable especially on Saturday for the consolation game with Wooster.  I know the folks at Wash U are working hard to make sure the Bears have the best contingent possible in Salem.  Go Bears!

[Pat Coleman]

Feature on the front page of interest to Final Four participants and fans here.

Faces of a champion

[walzy31]

the jeff fan base will be small but supportive! walzy what is the over/under for the number of jeff fans in amherst?

I'd bet we get somewhere between 75 and 100...I hope.  There probably won't be more than a handful of students there...stupid spring break.  I'm sure they will be a passionate bunch...I hear we are having a belated St. Patty's day celebration.

I've heard 2 fan busses since the demand is high. We won't have as many people as Hope (no one does), but we'll make our presence felt at the Civil Center...and at the local watering holes, I can promise you that.

Sounds like the all the other schools are going to be rolling deep.  Should make for a great atmosphere in Salem.  It usually turns into a big D3 bball love fest down there...lots of mutual respect for opposing fans and players (especially at the watering holes).  Looking forward to meeting the opposing fans, especially the Wash U crowd.  I kind of jilted coach kinbom (sp?) a few years back and still feel a little guilty about it.

I hope VanDerVaart from Wooster makes the trip.