D3 Top 25 Fan Poll

[02 Warhawk]

Impossible to tell how Oshkosh stacks up against D3 talent. They are 0-3 right now... will all three losses coming against top 25 scholarship-offering football programs.

I know there's no way you can keep an 0-3 team ranked, but I wouldn't doubt if they are better than 1/4 of the DIII ranked teams right now.

[smedindy]

That'll wash out when they play D-3 schedule. If they wind up at 7-3, or even 6-4 with one close loss, we'll know!

[Upstate]

My ballot this week...

Flame away 

1) UW Whitewater
2) Mary Hardin-Baylor
3) Linfield
4) Mount Union
5) North Central
6) Wesley
7) St. John Fisher
8) John Carroll
9) Johns Hopkins
10) Wabash
11) St. Thomas
12) Wartburg
13) Pacific Lutheran
14) Hobart
15) Wheaton (Ill)
16) UW-Platteville
17) Bethel
18) Concordia-Moorhead
19) Ithaca
20) Lycoming
21) Widener
22) Thomas More
23) Wittenberg
24) Hampden-Sydney
25) UW-Stevens Point

Yeah I saw today coming a mile away!

[02 Warhawk]

My ballot this week...

Flame away 

1) UW Whitewater
2) Mary Hardin-Baylor
3) Linfield
4) Mount Union
5) North Central
6) Wesley
7) St. John Fisher
8) John Carroll
9) Johns Hopkins
10) Wabash
11) St. Thomas
12) Wartburg
13) Pacific Lutheran
14) Hobart
15) Wheaton (Ill)
16) UW-Platteville
17) Bethel
18) Concordia-Moorhead
19) Ithaca
20) Lycoming
21) Widener
22) Thomas More
23) Wittenberg
24) Hampden-Sydney
25) UW-Stevens Point

Yeah I saw today coming a mile away!

Ahead of the curve.....we'll done

[Mr. Ypsi]

My ballot this week...

Flame away 

1) UW Whitewater
2) Mary Hardin-Baylor
3) Linfield
4) Mount Union
5) North Central
6) Wesley
7) St. John Fisher
8) John Carroll
9) Johns Hopkins
10) Wabash
11) St. Thomas
12) Wartburg
13) Pacific Lutheran
14) Hobart
15) Wheaton (Ill)
16) UW-Platteville
17) Bethel
18) Concordia-Moorhead
19) Ithaca
20) Lycoming
21) Widener
22) Thomas More
23) Wittenberg
24) Hampden-Sydney
25) UW-Stevens Point

Yeah I saw today coming a mile away!

Ahead of the curve.....we'll done

Well, except he still had #25 going against #5.  It's not like he predicted the upset!

[smedindy]

I had to bump a team to add Stevens Point. I couldn't justify throwing North Central and St. Thomas out entirely. I also didn't add St. John's, because I know how rivalry games are, but I was tempted to.

[02 Warhawk]

I had to bump a team to add Stevens Point. I couldn't justify throwing North Central and St. Thomas out entirely. I also didn't add St. John's, because I know how rivalry games are, but I was tempted to.

I added both St. John's and UWSP in my top 25. It was hard dropping two out because nobody in the bottom of my poll lost. I dropped St. Thomas low enough to have St. John's ahead of them...however I kept Concordia-MH ahead of St. John's, because of there head-to-head game.

My biggest problem was where to rank UWP and NCC in relation to each other. I ended up with UWP 9 and NCC 12. I couldn't justify keeping NCC in the top 10 after losing to an unranked team. Since UWP lost to a better team, I didn't drop them as much last week. It was a tough call either way.

[ExTartanPlayer]

My biggest problem was where to rank UWP and NCC in relation to each other. I ended up with UWP 9 and NCC 12. I couldn't justify keeping NCC in the top 10 after losing to an unranked team. Since UWP lost to a better team, I didn't drop them as much last week. It was a tough call either way.

I don't really like this logic.

Take team names off and just read the following:

Team A is 3-0, including a 34-27 win over Team B
Team B is 2-1 with a 28-7 win over Team C and the loss to Team A
Team C is 2-1 with a 28-7 loss to Team B

If we remove all preseason expectations and "where were they ranked at the time the game was played" notions, you'd probably look at this and rank Team A highest, Team B second, and Team C third.

IMO, UWSP should be ranked above NCC and UWP for now. NCC should remain above UWP.

If time proves that UWSP over NCC was a fluke, fine. But it drives me nuts to see teams get "anchored" to their preseason expectation instead of ranked based on actual results, like NCC ranked 5 spots ahead of UWSP in the top 25. In week 1, I get it, to a point. But now we're 30 percent of the way into the season for everybody.

[02 Warhawk]

My biggest problem was where to rank UWP and NCC in relation to each other. I ended up with UWP 9 and NCC 12. I couldn't justify keeping NCC in the top 10 after losing to an unranked team. Since UWP lost to a better team, I didn't drop them as much last week. It was a tough call either way.

I don't really like this logic.

Take team names off and just read the following:

Team A is 3-0, including a 34-27 win over Team B
Team B is 2-1 with a 28-7 win over Team C and the loss to Team A
Team C is 2-1 with a 28-7 loss to Team B

If we remove all preseason expectations and "where were they ranked at the time the game was played" notions, you'd probably look at this and rank Team A highest, Team B second, and Team C third.

IMO, UWSP should be ranked above NCC and UWP for now. NCC should remain above UWP.

If time proves that UWSP over NCC was a fluke, fine. But it drives me nuts to see teams get "anchored" to their preseason expectation instead of ranked based on actual results, like NCC ranked 5 spots ahead of UWSP in the top 25. In week 1, I get it, to a point. But now we're 30 percent of the way into the season for everybody.

I see your logic, but I can't see NCC dropping all the way down to the 20's after being #5. Or UWSP going from unranked to the mid teens. I don't think NCC is that bad to be in the 20's, nor is UWSP that good to be in the teens just so they can be ranked ahead of NCC.

There's pros and cons to either logic in this case.

[smedindy]

Sometimes the better team doesn't win, and head to head is a fluke and happenstance. Would North Central beat Stevens Point three out of five?

[jknezek]

Sometimes the better team doesn't win, and head to head is a fluke and happenstance. Would North Central beat Stevens Point three out of five?

It's kind of hard to answer that in this case. If it was a fluky win, something where the under dog got less than half the yards but won because of 5 turnovers then you can make that case. Here we had 20 yards total offense difference, UWSP had 4 more first downs, NCC's passing was bad, but UWSP's rushing was bad, penalties were mostly even, UWSP dominated time of possession, turnovers were mundane. The only stat that looks remotely fluky or out of place is third downs, where NCC stunk up the joint.

There is nothing to latch on to, other than past results, that makes you wonder if this is a huge fluke win. In that case, can you say USWP would lose 3 of the next 4 they played against NCC? Again, throwing past history and expectations out, it's really hard to make that call based on what actually happened on game day. Or at least as far as the stats can show.

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

So far I've received 9 of the 10 ballots... and all 6 possible combinations to order North Central, Platteville, and Stevens Point are represented.

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

2014 WEEK 4 TOP 25 FAN POLL

Rank         Team                    Points    Prev
  1)   UW-Whitewater (10)   250      1
T2)   Mary Hardin-Baylor   234     T2
T2)   Mount Union          234     T2
  4)   Wesley               216      4
  5)   Linfield             213      5
  6)   St John Fisher       195      7
  7)   John Carroll         185      8
  8)   Wartburg             180      9
  9)   Wabash               167     10
10)   Hobart               152     12
11)   Johns Hopkins        136     13
12)   Pacific Lutheran     128     16
13)   North Central        124      6
14)   Bethel               118     15
15)   UW Platteville        99     14
16)   Wittenberg            95     17
17)   Wheaton               73     19
T18)   Thomas More           70     18
T18)   UW-Stevens Point      70     NR
20)   Ithaca                68     20
21)   Concordia-Moorhead    49     23
22)   St Thomas             36     11
23)   Widener               35     21
24)   Hampden-Sydney        26     22
25)   Lycoming              24     24

Dropped Out: Heidelberg and Muhlenberg

Also Receiving Votes: Heidelberg (20), St John's (19), Chapman (7), Texas Lutheran (7), Illinois Wesleyan (5), Franklin (4), Washington & Jefferson (4), Centre (3), Rhodes (2), Muhlenberg (1), Willamette (1)

Voters: 02 Warhawk, D3MAFAN-MG, desertcat1, FCGrizzliesGrad, HSCTiger74, Mr. Ypsi, NCF, smedindy, thewaterboy, and Upstate

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

  1)   UW-Whitewater        250      ( 1,  1,  1,  1,  1,  1,  1,  1,  1,  1)
T2)   Mary Hardin-Baylor   234      ( 2,  2,  2,  2,  2,  3,  3,  3,  3,  4)
T2)   Mount Union          234      ( 2,  2,  2,  2,  2,  3,  3,  3,  3,  4)
  4)   Wesley               216      ( 3,  4,  4,  4,  4,  4,  4,  5,  5,  7)
  5)   Linfield             213      ( 3,  4,  4,  5,  5,  5,  5,  5,  5,  6)
  6)   St John Fisher       195      ( 5,  6,  6,  6,  6,  6,  7,  7,  8,  8)
  7)   John Carroll         185      ( 6,  6,  6,  7,  7,  7,  7,  9,  9, 11)
  8)   Wartburg             180      ( 5,  6,  8,  8,  8,  8,  8,  9, 10, 10)
  9)   Wabash               167      ( 7,  7,  8,  9,  9,  9, 10, 10, 10, 14)
10)   Hobart               152      ( 7,  8,  9, 10, 11, 11, 12, 12, 14, 14)
11)   Johns Hopkins        136      ( 8,  9, 10, 11, 12, 12, 13, 14, 17, 18)
12)   Pacific Lutheran     128      ( 9, 10, 11, 11, 12, 13, 14, 17, 17, 18)
13)   North Central        124      (10, 12, 12, 13, 13, 13, 15, 15, 16, 17)
14)   Bethel               118      (11, 12, 13, 13, 13, 14, 16, 16, 17, 17)
15)   UW Platteville        99      ( 9, 12, 14, 15, 15, 15, 16, 18, 21, --)
16)   Wittenberg            95      (10, 11, 12, 13, 16, 16, 17, 18, --, --)
17)   Wheaton               73      (11, 14, 15, 19, 19, 19, 20, 20, 25, 25)
T18)   Thomas More           70      (15, 15, 17, 18, 20, 20, 20, 21, 21, 23)
T18)   UW-Stevens Point      70      (13, 14, 15, 16, 18, 19, 20, 24, 25, --)
20)   Ithaca                68      (14, 15, 16, 18, 18, 19, 19, 22, 25, --)
21)   Concordia-Moorhead    49      (17, 17, 19, 19, 19, 22, 22, 24, --, --)
22)   St Thomas             36      (11, 18, 20, 22, 24, 25, --, --, --, --)
23)   Widener               35      (18, 20, 21, 21, 22, 23, 24, 24, --. --)
24)   Hampden-Sydney        26      (16, 20, 21, 23, 24, --, --, --, --, --)
25)   Lycoming              24      (20, 21, 21, 22, 23, 25, --, --, --, --)

26)   Heidelberg            20      (16, 23, 23)
27)   St John's             19      (21, 22, 23, 24, 24, 24, 25)
T28)   Chapman                7      (22, 23)
T28)   Texas Lutheran         7      (19)
30)   Illinois Wesleyan      5      (21)
T31)   Franklin               4      (22)
T31)   Wash & Jeff            4      (23, 25)
33)   Centre                 3      (23)
34)   Rhodes                 2      (24)
T35)   Muhlenberg             1      (25)
T35)   Willamette             1      (25)

[smedindy]

Sometimes the better team doesn't win, and head to head is a fluke and happenstance. Would North Central beat Stevens Point three out of five?

It's kind of hard to answer that in this case. If it was a fluky win, something where the under dog got less than half the yards but won because of 5 turnovers then you can make that case. Here we had 20 yards total offense difference, UWSP had 4 more first downs, NCC's passing was bad, but UWSP's rushing was bad, penalties were mostly even, UWSP dominated time of possession, turnovers were mundane. The only stat that looks remotely fluky or out of place is third downs, where NCC stunk up the joint.

There is nothing to latch on to, other than past results, that makes you wonder if this is a huge fluke win. In that case, can you say USWP would lose 3 of the next 4 they played against NCC? Again, throwing past history and expectations out, it's really hard to make that call based on what actually happened on game day. Or at least as far as the stats can show.

I didn't really mean to say the win was a fluke. Flukes happen, but this wasn't a total oddball win. It was plausible - not like North Park beating North Central.

The serious question is if you, as a voter, still think NC can beat UWSP three out of the next five?