MBB: Northwest Conference

[bbaddict]

ds0097:  Believe me I wish the conflict I have was as simple as Whitworth v. Willamette.  Let's just say sometimes I cheer for excellence or pick the team I want to win that night.  What's the relevance anyway?  If I had to pick a team this year, I'd probably say Willamette.  They have my favorite coach & play well together as a team.  They have a couple of superstars In Olinger & Stuvland -- but mostly just a whole bench of solid players that can work together to get the job done.  FIfe has to be one of the best freshman in the conference.  He'll probably get better at defense when he's bigger.

As far as the NCAA not wanting to fly people into Salem or Spokane.  Hello.  Linfield Football has enjoyed home field advantage for years now & football teams are larger than bb teams!  Salem is not that far from Portland.  I'll grant that Spokane is out of the loop, they got screwed on that in 2003, but as I understand it, it was a lack of available facilities.   I don't agree with you that ONLY UPS can do anything at the NCAA tourney, but then, I've seem Whitworth & Willamette play this year?  Have you?  Or have you looked at the team stats on NWC site?  I'll agree that UPS dominated a couple of years ago, but this year they've squeaked by on a couple of games.

Spooh:   Thanks for your post.  I've never said that UPS isn't good -- just that I'm not rooting for them.  My only point is that they're not as good as their hype & they can be beaten.   And, I also said if they make it to the NCAA tourney, I'll root for them.

[bearcatsfan3]

Gentlemen, its like a whole new board in here! Awesome!

1.  BHawks, UPS by 20 is a ballsy pick my friend...yes, I'm sure you're citing recent history in Tacoma (ugly, ugly losses for WU) but this is, in essence, the conference title game, and with two good teams, a twenty point blowout would be shocking...Explain to me how a UPS squad that was down double digits the entire time at Willamette (until the 1:00 mark of the 2nd half) is going to gameplan/play so much better that there is a 30 point turnaround? Remember, this is the same UPS team that just got ambushed by 20+ in Spokane, from tip to end...if you would have said UPS by 5, I'd give you that as a respectable prediction...
2. Whitworth folks: Is there room left on the Pirate bandwagon? BHawks does have a point...Where were these Pirate backers when it looked like they had no shot at the title/NCAA's?? They are clearly playing amazing basketball right now, and are sitting basically in 2nd place (as the loser of WU/UPS will fall to third), but let's stop short of declaring this a Whitwash...they will be on the road in the NWC title game (barring a total collapse from the 'cats or loggers), and much can be said for home court advantage (yes, they beat the bearcats in Salem, but the "stomping" you refer to had WU down 5 with 4 to go when Olinger fouls out...)
3. As far as NCAA tourney predicts goes, how can you jump from UPS getting smacked in the mouth by whitworth to "UPS will go to the Elite Eight"? While Logger fans have every right to be confident, this is borderline ridiculous...worry about the NWC tournament first...(by the way, I believe any of the three NWC top dogs could win a game, maybe two in the NCAA's)

My Own Crystal Ball:
WU beats the Loggers in Overtime, as McVey will foul out and the Bearcats will shoot in the high 50's to get the 96-92 victory...Willamette will follow with perhaps an equally as tough game in Newberg, where Fox's seniors will put on one hell of a show, but ultimately run out of gas, as WU wins the NWC with a 85-80 victory...Whitworth will survive Whitman (what else is new) and a surprisingly tough Boxer squad in FGrove (how can WU beat them by 35, then they beat LC by 31) to finish second, and will host the Loggers in Spokane in the semis...

I will say, that as a WU fan, my biggest fear is not Tacoma Friday, but Spokane/Tacoma looming as a possible mountain to climb the week after that (if WU can't win Friday)

[bearcatsfan3]

On another couple of notes:

1. No one has explained Karma yet, but I see my boy BHawks just keeps dropping...why?

2. Does PC and the crew know WU beat Linfield on Saturday? Their Region and overall record hasn't been updated...

3. Whoever thinks Bob Gailard should "hang it up" is out of their mind...sure, LC is a far cry from the glory days of the early portion of this decade, but they have some great young talent, and Gailard can flat out coach (he may rub some people the wrong way from what I've heard, but he has too many career wins to "hang it up" after a season where their post player (Magnuson I think is his name) didn't play, and they relied heavily on sophs and freshman)...

4. What the heck happened to Whitman's season? Started off well, then turned in a standard Whitman performance...chalk me up as being way off base on the Molitor coach of the year talk a month or two ago...

[blackhawks4]

Beacrats I thought you knew me better by now, would I ever pick UPS in a nail biter??

Gotta agree with bearcatsfan, any coach that plays for a D1 national chaqmpionship is allright in my book too.  L & C is always well prepared, despite the lack of talent as of late (although their younger kids look pretty decent).

If you think Willamette is coming into Tacoma and beating the Loggers friday on their homecourt you're crazy, not gonna happen.  Honestly, UPS at home and on the road are 2 different teams.  UPS had ww by 20 in the first half out here before almost choking it away.  And there is no way UPS loses on senior night. 

McVey took what 5 shots the past 2 games???  He played 15 min due to fouls at whitman and it sounded like whitworth flopped around like a dying fish on him.  Shame, was hoping someone would stand up and play defense like a man.

Whitworth is hot! But did they peak too early.  Look for them to fizzle out and lose in that first round playoff game at home!!! They embarassed UPS and beat willamette twice, I see them dropping first round.

I see Loggers winning a first round game in the NCAA (anything else would be a huge bonus) tourney but not ww or wu for similair reasons as cited by ds007. 

Curtiss is a scorer and he produces. He had a bad one at whitworth, but in all those games (even when he's off) he produces and puts up numbers.  When he was a freshmen he was a shooter, his game has developed and if you see him play, he goes to the rim first!

UPS doesn't need your karma. 

[andrewf]

Yeah I'm curious what karma is as well.

[David Collinge]

Yeah I'm curious what karma is as well.

That certainly is a Frequently Asked Question in here.

[NWC bball fan]

Where in the world did you hear that Whitworth flopped around on McVey like a fish out of water.  I am not aware of one flop!!  Did he even have any offensive fouls?  The simple fact is........McVey is a great athlete and has a great D3 body.  But he lack any post moves what so ever.  He can catch the ball with his back to the basket, turn to his strong hand, jump way up in the air and shoot it.  That is his only move.  And if he is left open, he can dunk.  He is a pretty good presence on defense, but nothing special.  Definately one of the more dominating players in the league, but not close to player of the year caliber.  Born from Whitman, except as of late as the whole team has seemed to crumble, has out produced McVey.  You are full of bold predictions, and they are always in favor of UPS.  When someone else praises thier team, you shoot them down, and yet again talk up UPS.  You are the only person on this entire board that thinks UPS only looses when they play horrible and when they play decent, spank everyone else.  They just do not have dominant talent over the rest of the league.  However, I do think they will win the league and then lose to Whitworth by 10 + and your  beloved home court in the conference championship.  I bet you that the UPS coaching staff and players are very scared of Whiworth.  I can't wait to hear your reply.

I am not so sure that people are bandwagoners for begining to post.  I have liked and followed Whitworth all year, just because I was not posting on this site, does not mean I am now on the bandwagon.  Like mentioned, people do have lives outside of this site.  This is a fun place to discuss basketball, and most of the time the discussion is good.  It seems however there are some peope who act like they know a little more about the game than they do.  As far as home court advantage goes...  It is all mental.  Good teams go out there and play their game, regardless of the court.  By the end of the year, and experienced teams, should not let where the games is played be an excuse for a win or loss.  If McVey and Curtiss are as great as Blackhawk makes them out to be, as seniors, they should be able to win anywhere!!!

[bearcatsfan3]

I think the implication that BHawks, myself, and maybe pinecone "have no lives" because we post in this site is a stretch...we're simply excited about our teams, and, obviously like to argue about things...anyone posting in here, yet clinging to the "hey, I have a life buddy, you don't" is the kettle calling the teapot black argument...I think if you look at the stats of the other conferences' postings, MANY people across the nation must be suffering from a lack of "life."

Question:  What has been the key for Whitworth's resurgence lately?  8 game win streak is impressive, especially considering after the PLU loss they were looking lost...any thoughts from Pirate Nation?

DC-thanks for the karma read...

[NWC bball fan]

Bearcat, I appreciate your message.  I guess I followed up on the "better things to do" comment because I was responding to Blackhawks comments about people just starting to post, and his continous insults about irrevevant information, when his is no better.  I think everyone has valuable stuff to say, and I think the arguing is great, but the personal attacks are childish.  With that said, I am not going to get into this conversation anymore, and strictly talk and argue basktetball.  That is the fun part.

Personally, I feel that Whitworth was just not playing to their potential earlier in the year.  All of thier losses have been a result of blowing a big lead and losing in the closing seconds, being up about 5 in the last minute or two and giving it away, or performing down to the level of the competition on a night after a tough loss in the closing seconds.  That is not to make excuses, but to say Whitworth did not know how to finish early in the year and no do.  They have 5 guys averaging 11 points or more (Williams might be a little lower now, but is leading the league in minutes played and assists) and have a 6th man who has lit UPS up for 50 points in two games.  They were stuggeling for a while to find their indentity.  I think now they believe in their Coach and eachother and they have been very dominant.  The two forward Pecht and Tucker are very difficult match up problems and their big man has been dominating the interior at times and has done a great job on the boards.  Young commands a lot of attention and really stretches the defense.  Williams is just solid every night.  Basically I think there play over the last month is a result of finally displaying what has been there all year.  With that said, I think Whitworth is still capable of being beat, but they would have to play bad.  Pecth is as good as any player in the country the last 8-10 games and his versatility and ability to score anyway possible has really propelled the Bucs.  The last two game of the season and playoffs should be exciting with the top three teams.  I look forward to watching some great basketball.

[bbaddict]

Me too -- great basketball ahead!!  Isn't it great that there's 3 teams so close in the running that people are nervous?  Better than just one team shutting out everyone -- or at least it's more interesting.

By the way, I didn't say people don't have lives because they post here.  I was responding to a nasty comment about me being a new poster, so how could such & such possibly be.  I believe we got it straightened out.

So -- let's talk about basketball.  What is Karma?  Do we get to vote on it?

[blackhawks4]

"I am not aware of one flop!!  Did he even have any offensive fouls?"

McVey's very first foul was offensive, it was a 1-on-1 post move from the block where the defender went down.  Come'on we all know that one.

"You are full of bold predictions, and they are always in favor of UPS."

Yes.

"You are the only person on this entire board that thinks UPS only looses when they play horrible and when they play decent, spank everyone else."

Never said anything of the sort.

"lose to Whitworth by 10 + and your  beloved home court in the conference championship"

Not at home.  Just promise you'll gimme a "Go Loggers" when your boys are eliminated

"I bet you that the UPS coaching staff and players are very scared of Whiworth."

LOL.  Ahhhhhhh...

"experienced teams, should not let where the games is played be an excuse for a win or loss"

Seems to me home court advantage has been big part of top three teams w's and l' this year

"his continous insults about irrevevant information"

Scroll back, point to one.

"but the personal attacks are childish"

Point to one

"Pecth is as good as any player in the country the last 8-10 games"

He's played well as of late and has made himself a NWC POTY candidate, but maybe you should see some of the players on the other side and in the midwest first... he's nowhere near.

And i have a life...i keep myself occupied...just yesterday i read every single post anyone from any conference has ever made on this board

[blackhawks4]

bearcatsfan...we've has our differences, but you're the only one i trust on this (and spooh but hes been in and out, but at least here for the season)...

if it was just you and me, what would you give me for karma...

I'd give you 100 karma points ...just as long as you don't disagree with the powers that be

[pineconefan]

Bearcats, to answer your earlier question about the key to Whitworth's streak - I think it comes down to a simple match-up advantage.  The Pirates are really the only team in the league with two true forwards playing alongside a post.  Nearly every other NWC team starts a three-guard lineup.  With Pecht starting at small forward, he has had a huge match-up advantage that the Pirates have been able to take advantage of.

BH4 - I am agreeing with you for like the third time in the last week.  Sheesh, what's the world coming to?  Actually you are very correct that Whitworth needs to guard againt peaking early.  The last four weeks have been a steady build in intensity - first they had to come off of the Tacoma trip disaster by beating a hot Whitman team, the next week was about revenge against the giveaway at George Fox, the next week was a big win at Willamette, followed finally by a statement win over UPS.  This week could be ripe for a let down if the players and coaches aren't careful. If it wasn't the last week of the season and the playoffs so close, I think the danger would be greater.

But as it is, if Whitworth wins twice this week, the worst they do is host the first round playoff game.

[NWC bball fan]

How do you know he is no where near the best (Pecht) Have you seen all these team play?  I have seen quite a few of them play!!  And will say he is in the top of the nation for D3 athletes.  I did not say he was the best, but his play as of late is right up there!  His abilities that he brings to the court each night are unlike any player in the conference.  He is the only player that is truly unguardable.  If his numbers are not up on a given night is because he did not get the touches, or he guarded himself.  I don't see how you cannot see that.  Especially if you are the talent evaluater that you say you are.  You responded just how I thought you would?  Are you really that conceited or are you just having fun on the board?  I hope it is the second of the two!  Mark my words.....Whitworth will not lose to UPS if they get the chance to play them, regardless of the court.

[NWC bball fan]

I almost forgot.  McVey had one foul the entire night against Whitworth.  So if Whitworth was doing all this flopping, it actually only happened one time, if any.  Foul trouble was not the issue.  He just simply got out played.  His first two shots were sent right back at him.  In fact, if anything the refs were putting him on the line.  They were rewarding him for catching the ball, turning to his right hand, dipping his shoulder, and jumping up in the air while throwing the ball in the direction of the rim.  If not for that he would have been held to about 4-6 points.  Whitworth spent the game with there 4 and 5 in fould trouble the entire night.  They barely played 40 minutes between the two of them.  But they did both finish 6-6 from the floor.