MBB: Northwest Conference

[playball]

Every year these all conference teams come out and the top teams get a few extra players on them compared to lower teams, but it makes no sense.  Why not give the top teams all the positions they deserve?  How does Brakebush get named HM over Valle when when Brakebush averaged 13.4 ppg on 41% shooting and 3.7 rebounds a game and Valle averaged 12.5 ppg on 52% shooting and 3.9 rebounds a game.  So much more efficient scoring and more rebounds.  Not to mention 14-2 vs 9-7 and Valle is still playing.  What is really irritating is that WW's 6th man gets named, but not their two year starter at the 3 spot because the starter is more defense oriented.  I find all conference teams completely unsatisfying.   

A tad nit picky arguing about HM spots and the fact that the whole WW team isn't represented.  However, I do agree with how these All Conference teams are a big question mark.  But then again, they don't mean much in the end.  Like you said, 14-2 vs.9-7, I doubt Valle holds too much of a grudge since he is still playing.  I would go with Brakebush since he did more with less around him. 

[(509)Rat]

The only thing those two did that was better than Farnsworth was total points. Congrats to Batiuk for scoring a lot of points by taking almost twice as many shots as Farnsworth and 1.5 times more shots than Eisenhardt.

FG%, TO's forced, total rebounds, all belong to Farnsworth. So yeah, I think I could easily justify putting him ahead of one or both of the other guys.

Blah, at Linfield Farnsworth had trouble scoring over their 6'9 freshman who is still very much a work in progress.  Farnsworth was throwing up all kinds of garbage against a defender who stood still with his arms straight in the air.  I came away not impressed and wondering how he averaged double figure points.  Farnsworth is a backup post if he plays with Batiuk or Eisenhardt. Where the hell are you getting your stats?! Both Batiuk and Eisenhardt average more rebounds. TO's forced? Where did you find that stat? He has them in field goal percentage although both of them can shoot from long range with Batiuk being one of the best 3pt shooters in the conference.

If one game made up a season, Batiuk would have been POY (since missing 7 wouldnt matter). I have a feeling your fellow alumnus would disagree with your "one game of Linfield v Whiworth tells me everything I need to know about a player" hypothesis 

nwcsports.com - Used conference stats for the most part since playing Pacifica and Bethesda isn't quite like playing Redlands and Chapman. Although I did miss Batiuk's rebounds per game which was higher than Farnsworth.

Blocks and steals

Once Batiuk got to conference play he shot 30% from 3...

[madzillagd]

Have a question for the Doty supporters and I don't want this to come off as snarky but I'm sure it will.  I've been following the NWC from afar the last few years as my nephew was being recruited, his teammates/opponents that ended up in the NWC, and as a CLU alum with the football battles we've had with Linfield.  Truth be told, it's a question that you can throw at a lot of coaches around the country (CLU's included). 

How much money does he need to have a successful program? 

I'm strictly talking about success on the floor, not in the classroom etc. to make it simple.  There may be more to it than just money but that was the defense that was thrown out there when somebody questioned his abilities.  From my perspective there are teams/coaches that have a legitimate argument when it comes to money, admissions/financial aid, etc. so it's not that I don't agree that can be an issue for some.  However, I'm having a hard time understanding why Linfield would be one of those places. 

You have the best football team on the West Coast so the name recognition for athletics has to be the best of any D3 school in the NW.  Your acceptance rate is 76% so basically if a kid is breathing they are getting into the school.  Academically you aren't at the top of the conference but you're doing well in the middle.  Cost wise the school is on the lower end of the conference and comparable to the top hoops team in the conference in Whitworth.  In terms of a recruiting base, you've got Portland and Seattle that are a relatively short drive away with millions of people and thousands of kids to recruit from.  This is D3 hoops, nobody is flying kids in for visits and coaches aren't travelling around the country on plane rides recruiting.  I feel like I'm missing something because I'm just not seeing why this program can't be better than it has been the past 10 years.  Like I said, this isn't just about Linfield either.  As a CLU alum, I've been asking the same question of our program for many years.  We have just about the best facilities of any D3 school on the West coast now, a huge recruiting pool sitting outside of LA, and we've done nothing to take advantage of that when it comes to basketball. 

How much money does Doty need to run a successful program because from an outsiders perspective it seems like he's got everything else lined up in his favor.  When you have a coach that has been around for that long, who has had time to establish a network of contacts with high school and AAU coaches spanning hundreds of miles, and has been able to coach kids through his program that have probably gone on to coach within the area as well, it just seems like a major cop out to claim it's a budget issue and leave it at that. Is there more to it because I feel like I'm missing something.

[playball]

When I read your post it didn't come off as snarky at all. 

Increased funding would help Linfield Basketball by giving it the ability to higher a full time assistant coach.  As shown on ESPN.com lately with the recruitment of high profile football players, relationships with assistant coaches can and fairly often will outweigh the verbal commitments to the school if something happens to that coach.  Players have been known to vacate commitments when the coach who recruited them (generally an assistant) leaves the school.  The need for an assistant is evident in other facets as well.  Being able to lead a practice while the head coach is out recruiting, being able to break down game film, developing certain aspects of the team or player.  Having one assistant coach (sometimes more than one as evident in the NWC) is vital in securing a winning program.

Having gone to Linfield, one of the major draws there was the assistant coach (who was part time at best and still studying) paying attention to me and making me feel wanted by the program. 

You said that Linfield was comparable to WW so here is an example
http://www.whitworthpirates.com/sports/mbkb/coaches/index

3 assistant coaches who all have coaching experience at various levels prior to WW, including the top assistant who has experience at the D.1 level at different capacities.

http://www.linfield.edu/sports/roster.php?sport=mbkb#coach

And I post this not as a dig to the abilities of the Linfield coaches:
We have a soccer coach, two students still studying, another former student who coaches the JV program almost exclusively, and a guy who does the filming.  Not a dig, just what it is.

Rat, the point formercat was making is that the only time he was able to see Farnsworth he wasn't all that great.  And as for your other comment, I doubt there is much anything else to go on since Farnsworth hasn't made an impact up there until this year.
Plus he is a 10 and 5 guy, how does that equal first team?

Also, to make this long post even longer I wanted to say congrats on a good career to James Hollins who dealt with a knee reconstruction and still came back to lead his team in to the playoffs.  Impressive

[madzillagd]

That makes sense although a lot of recruiting takes place in the offseason so you shouldn't be dealing with practice time etc. too much.  But if you can only cover one location and not 3 because you don't have the guys to head in different directions you're reducing your net so I can see that being a problem.  In basketball I don't think the assistant has quite as much value as they do in football though just because you are dealing with a much smaller pool of candidates.  The football program is going to be interacting with a dozens of prospects and it's impossible for the head coach to be connecting with each of them on a regular basis.  With hoops though you are dealing with much smaller numbers and there's a bigger expectation by the kids to be interacting with the head coach at the D3 level than at the D1 level. 

[Whatagame]

Interesting conversation.  Not sure if you all have visited this website, but you can search any NWC school by name (or any NCAA D1-D3 school for that matter) and peruse current expense/revenues data for each school's athletics department, here:

http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/GetOneInstitutionData.aspx

The little glossary tab in upper right will help you more fully understand the data.

[playball]

That makes sense although a lot of recruiting takes place in the offseason so you shouldn't be dealing with practice time etc. too much.  But if you can only cover one location and not 3 because you don't have the guys to head in different directions you're reducing your net so I can see that being a problem.  In basketball I don't think the assistant has quite as much value as they do in football though just because you are dealing with a much smaller pool of candidates.  The football program is going to be interacting with a dozens of prospects and it's impossible for the head coach to be connecting with each of them on a regular basis.  With hoops though you are dealing with much smaller numbers and there's a bigger expectation by the kids to be interacting with the head coach at the D3 level than at the D1 level.

From my own experience the majority of my recruitment occurred in season.  That is why I could relate to later on how important assistants were during the in season recruitment period.  It is tough to get players in your program when other schools have already made an impact and the first one on the scene generally do better on getting the kid on campus.  However, you are correct that the summer basketball scene is a major recruiting time for most coaches. 

[Bearcat Press]

-How did Malley only get HM?!? I had him first team. Granted I basically only watched WW games this season, but he lit us up. He had 30-something last week against us.

I'd have put him Second Team at the most.  Malley scored a ton of points because he was a volume shooter.  Yes, he could single-handedly take over a game, but he had some absolutely horrific shooting nights too.  That's how you end up averaging 17.3 ppg while shooting 36.8% from the field and 33% from three.

I hate to be the pessimist here, but barring the arrival of some outstanding freshmen or transfers, the Bearcats could be shockingly bad next year.  We lose our top three scorers (Malley, Babcock-Krenk, Dart), and our top three-point shooter (Hughes).  That's four starters gone off a 7-18, 4-10 team that lost eight straight to close the season.  Yuck.

[madzillagd]

Interesting conversation.  Not sure if you all have visited this website, but you can search any NWC school by name (or any NCAA D1-D3 school for that matter) and peruse current expense/revenues data for each school's athletics department, here:

http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/GetOneInstitutionData.aspx

The little glossary tab in upper right will help you more fully understand the data.

Hadn't seen this.  Very cool stuff.

[playball]

Interesting conversation.  Not sure if you all have visited this website, but you can search any NWC school by name (or any NCAA D1-D3 school for that matter) and peruse current expense/revenues data for each school's athletics department, here:

http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/GetOneInstitutionData.aspx

The little glossary tab in upper right will help you more fully understand the data.

Hadn't seen this.  Very cool stuff.

Yeah!  That is cool!

Also shows that the Eastern Washington schools spend 6k a player where as Linfield and other "valley" schools spend between 1k-2k per

[TryMeTeam]

Playball:

If I could give out Karma I would to you.  I know you are not a Hollins (basketball) fan like I am, but to give him a shout out is, to use your word, impressive.  But it was impressive.  Knowing he would miss a good portion of the season and could not play in the playoffs, he still came back from the second knee surgery and played well doing so.  I don't think they make the playoffs without him.  I am glad the coaches recognized him with a return trip to 1st team.  I also think that says volumes about his character.

B Press:

I appreciate your not being only a fan, but a realistic and critical in your assessment of your team.  Karma for you, too.  Oh wait,...  Keandre could learn a thing or two from you.

It is the final most of us thought it would be!  Should be a great game!

[D O.C.]

I have to be snarky.     Injuries, budget, bad bounces, baloney.

History, I know, but one year the gym at LINFIELD namesake found out some players were involved in shenanigans while on a road trip to Alaska. Seven of the ten players were not allowed to play the rest of the season. JV's were brought up, athletes from other Cardinal and Purple sports teams were brought aboard and even some intermural players got to live out their dream.
LINFIELD won the NWC, the regionals and lost their first in Kansas City at the NAIA tourney, again.

The fact that the current basketball coach didn't stick with the Ted Wilson program tells me a good deal.

[playball]

I have to be snarky.     Injuries, budget, bad bounces, baloney.

History, I know, but one year the gym at LINFIELD namesake found out some players were involved in shenanigans while on a road trip to Alaska. Seven of the ten players were not allowed to play the rest of the season. JV's were brought up, athletes from other Cardinal and Purple sports teams were brought aboard and even some intermural players got to live out their dream.
LINFIELD won the NWC, the regionals and lost their first in Kansas City at the NAIA tourney, again.

The fact that the current basketball coach didn't stick with the Ted Wilson program tells me a good deal.

Different time, different rules on scholarships.  Also, was there a three point line?  Get out the history books for when Ted Wilson went ape on his team and pulled up a bunch of other guys.  My freshmen year we weren't picked to do very well and we over achieved and only missed out on playoffs by a tie breaker. Next year, we lost a good game in which Nate the great went beserk on us up in Spokane.  Junior year, I think you'd remember DOC (if you go to games anymore) we made it to playoffs but another early round exit.  The point I'm making is, not all good teams make playoffs.  Also, if success was built on systems, why isn't everyone coaching the same systems as Wooden and Dean Smith?  The game evolves

[(509)Rat]

Whitworth beating up on Whitman. 53-32. Whitman is "0"-fer from 3. I'd expect them to hit a few in the second half and close the gap. Whitworth handling the pressure with relative ease which will have to change drastically for this to end up being a game

[(509)Rat]

83-52...it got worse for Whitman before it got better