MBB: Northwest Conference

[UPSoundLogs]

Well, I'm very impressed to see the Loggers come back from their Wisconsin trip with two wins!  I'm not sure how good UW Stout and BS are but two wins in the Midwest is two wins in the Midwest!  From the box scores it looked like everyone played pretty well especially Williams and Krauel.  It's really good to see Krauel putting up big numbers, even though he's coming off the bench.  He's a very good player. 

Very suprised to see WW lose to Chapman   What is up with that???  It's very dissapointing  to see one of our supposed best out of the NWC lose to a cupcake like Chapman.  Does anyone have details on that game...I hope there's some kind of excuse, like maybe WW's starting five all sat out of the entire game.

[cawcdad]

. . .Very suprised to see WW lose to Chapman   What is up with that???  It's very dissapointing  to see one of our supposed best out of the NWC lose to a cupcake like Chapman.  Does anyone have details on that game...I hope there's some kind of excuse, like maybe WW's starting five all sat out of the entire game.

I was at the game. Chapman is not that bad. They also beat Cal Lu. A parent told me WW had a couple of key injuries. But as I stated earlier, Chapman played a zone D and dared WW to shot from the outside, which WW didn't do well. They hit 1 trey on the night I believe. I was surprised the Rats didn't really try to penetrate to collapse the zone and then kick out and get shorter jump shots. They seemed content to move the ball around the perimeter. When the game got down to the time to foul, Chapman simply didn't miss their free throws.

[UPSoundLogs]

Cawcdad,

Thanks for the game details, upon further review I realized that you had already posted about the WW vs. Chapman game earlier, so sorry about making you do double time. 

It sounds like you're not real impressed with WW, I'm assuming they have taken a step back from last year then?  I've been hearing from the Bucs faithful that this years WW players are as good, if not better than last years players.  From an outsider (a non WW fan) what is your perspective?  Even if Chapman is "not that bad" I dont see last years WW squad losing to a team that is in the middle of the pack in the SCIAC(WW was darn good last year).  Maybe I'm just clueless and Chapman is a new west coast powerhouse...thats possible too I guess .  Any thoughts?

[cawcdad]

Not having seen WW last year I have no basis for comparison. Also not knowing the team, I do not know how key the injured players are. The parent I talked to seemed to think they are critical. So all I am going on is my perception from one game and that is that WW seemed content to play Chapman's game. Is that the same style for WW too? The Rats also pretty much stayed in a zone D forcing outside shots. Chapman hit their treys better than WW.

Is Chapman a new West Coast power? I do not think so, but they do play good defense. The day after the WW game they beat an athletic CLU team, that likes up tempo and physical play, in a low scoring affair. So Chapman obviously dictated the tempo.

[LogShow]

The Loggers took a major step this weekend.  Congrats on a great road trip and tourney title.  Sounds like the team impressed a few people over in the mid-west.  The logs have this week to rest up and get better before they head down to Portland to take on Warner Pac...now that's gonna be a game!  Keep it rolling loggers!!!

[cawcdad]

There are pictures up of last Friday's games at the Cal Tech Tournament:
Cal Lutheran vs. Whitman
Chapman vs. Whitworth
I apologize for the poor quality, but the gym was dark and I was fighting the light and my flash all afternoon.

[Gregory Sager]

Even if Chapman is "not that bad" I dont see last years WW squad losing to a team that is in the middle of the pack in the SCIAC

Chapman isn't in the SCIAC. It's an independent.

Well, I'm very impressed to see the Loggers come back from their Wisconsin trip with two wins!  I'm not sure how good UW Stout and BS are but two wins in the Midwest is two wins in the Midwest!

UW-Stout (3-2) was picked in the SID's preseason poll to finish seventh in the nine-team WIAC in 2007-08. Last season the Blue Devils went 12-13, 5-11.

Bemidji State is 1-4 this season, with its other three losses all coming to D2 teams that beat the Beavers by around the same amount, more or less, that the Loggers beat them. Their win over Northland in the consolation game of the UW-Stout tourney isn't really anything to brag about. Last season the Beavers went 5-23.

[LogShow]

So you're telling me we played two of the worst teams in the midwest?  I thought beating a WIAC school on their home court in their tourney would be a good thing?

I still think both were solid wins! And the pollsters seem to agree bumping UPS 7 spots to #12.

[Drake Palmer]

Don't let Mr. Sager rain on your parade.  I was one of the only posters who actually saw your beloved Loggers play this weekend & happened to post about them on the WIAC board & briefly on my home board – the MIAC.  Although UPS didn't exactly beat upper Midwest powerhouses, those were decent wins.  I've seen D2 Bemidji State play twice, along with UW-Stout, & UW-River Falls.  And pay careful attention to what Greg said – Bemidji State lost to other D2 colleges by similar scores to what UPS dropped on them. Last time I checked UPS is a D3 college. 

One of the reasons why Stout was picked as low as they were (7th) was because no one knew about the talent level of the incoming transfers.  Stout is going to be a solid club in the WIAC.  They picked up a former D-1 scholarship player (University of Minnesota, & Univ. Idaho) who is going to be decent for them in 2G Miles Webb.  They also picked up a nice JC college transfer in Alex Mason who plays the point.  If Stout wouldn't have had Mason at PG, the UPS & Stout game could have really gotten out of hand.   This is one of the reasons why Bemidji State lost as badly as they did.  Their guards couldn't withstand the UPS full court pressure.

Both Stout transfers are Minnesota players which is why I'm familiar with them & their games.  Although I don't expect Stout to contend for a title in the tough WIAC, they'll be a tough out. 

UW-River Falls was picked by the WIAC Coaches to finish 6th in the WIAC this season. I realize I'm using the comparative scores & common opponents concept, (but what else do we have to work with in D3?  ) but the same Bemidji State that got clocked by UPS, drilled River Falls 80-61 in an exhibition game earlier this month.

Again I'll say I was quite impressed by UPS.  Obviously I've not seen all the MIAC teams yet this year, but what I saw from UPS on Saturday tells me they would definitely contend for our league title.  I've not seen as many quick players on one team in a long time.

Tell me a little bit about Lewis & Clark & why are they picked to finish ahead of the Loggers in league play?  I looked at their roster & while they don't seem to be a real tall team with a large post presence, aside from their 6-1 PG, they go 6-4, 6-4, 6-4, & 6-5.  They seem to be a taller, athletic team with good team quickness & good outside shooting?  One of the perceived weaknesses I see with your Logger team is that aside from Marsh, your outside shooting may be a bit streaky & a good zone might be your undoing.

[UPSoundLogs]

Drake,

Thank you for your break down of the UW-Stout tournament and your views on how UPS played. 

As for Lewis and Clark...unfortunately I haven't seen them play this year so I cant be too much help.  But I did see them last year (LC is very fun to watch), and they return most of the same impact players so I can give you a little rundown. 

Although they aren't tall, they play very physical and hit the boards very hard.  Especially Taboni and Rivera.  They have pretty good outside shooting from their guards and are able to get a lot of open outside shots because of Tillery who is their VERY quick point guard that can get into the lane with the best of them.  They get up and down the floor really well because all of their players are athletic and they dont have big guys to slow them down.  Their interior defense is suprisingly good for how short they are, I think its mostly due to how physical Rivera plays.  Although my guess is they would struggle inside if a team has forwards/posts that are 6-8 or 6-9...LC simply isnt tall enough. 

So far this year UPS and LC have played two of the same opponents and while I know it isn't the most accurate way to compare two teams, its the only means of comparison I have for you for this season. 

They both played Corban:    @UPS 124     Corban 95
                                             LC    77      @Corban 70

They both played Northwest:   UPS 97    @NW 82
                                                 @LC 75     NW  67

So that's the best I've got, hopefully it helped to answer your question. 

[LogShow]

Drake thanks for giving the Loggers some love.  I am glad you enjoyed watching the team play! 

Looking at the stats Marsh did not have a good shooting game.  Last year I think he shot around 42% from 3, so I would take him over just about anyone else.  He can be a bit streaky at times, but he is actually a pretty complete player so I wouldn't mind seeing him put the ball on the floor after he misses a couple in a row.  On a side note who is your "home" team?

LC reminds me a lot of UPS in a way...its like their coach recruited to strictly match-up with UPS.  Like UPSoundlogs said they are athletic and quick, tough and physical, also they can really shoot the 3.

I think the main reason for LC being voted ahead of UPS was two fold...1) LC had a 2-1 advantage in head to head last year. 2) Coaches didn't feel like UPS deserved it based on losing 5 of their last 6 games to end the year.

[UPSoundLogs]

Logshow-

1) Your right about Taylor Marsh, he's a very good player.  I think a lot of people only see him as a three point shooter, which is obviously his best skill, but he can do a lot more as well.  He also provides great leadership for the Loggers which is one of the biggest things they missed last year. 

2) I think LC being pre-season voted ahead of UPS in the NWC was for the reasons you mentioned in your post, as well as the fact that no one took into account how much the Logger's improved...they are MUCH MUCH better than last year. 

Also, I hate to bring this up again but I'm still trying to figure out how the heck WW dropped one to Chapman   La Verne even beat Chapman   I had a chance to see La Verne play when they came to play UPS a couple weeks ago and without sounding too heartless, I'll just say they were not impressive.  UPS beat them by 45 and the Logs put in their bench with about 7 to go.  I know I'm reading into this a little too much, but that's a really rough loss for the Bucs especially after hearing about how good they were supposed to be.  Is anyone else as disturbed by this as me?

[Drake Palmer]

You Logger fans have got a pretty quick PG in Antwan Williams yourself. He put up a few "oops, he's not really going to take that shot is he?" but successfuly hit a couple of them.  He also had some nice penetrate & dishes for either Krauel &  Foster.  On a team of nice talent, the other standout player for me was Robert Krauel. Cat had some crazy quicks around the basket which he used to his advantage against taller opponents. A buddy & I were commenting on the fact that seemingly the one go-to move the UPS coaches  must teach all their post players is the up & under. The move was made even more effective because of Krauel's speed.

It's interesting that many of these juniors & seniors were a key part of your run to the regional finals in 06 against Ill. Wesleyan. I'll be keeping tabs on your team this year. Good luck.

Logs - I don't really have a "home team" per se, but live in the St. Paul, MN area & over the years I've been directly & indirectly involved with various levels of youth/AAU basketball. So a number of these kids I've seen play at at an earlier age & it's fun to watch them play on a college level.  I usually watch most of the MIAC teams play at least twice, along with a handful of WIAC games & D2 schools.

[LogShow]

UPSoundlogs,

WW had a bad slip up, I am sure they will get better and be ready for league.  Now they did have a lot of hype, but that was all from their fans and or supporters...of course they are going to talk their team up even if deep down they know they have a ways to go.

I would have loved to see Hayford's reaction during and after that game, this year he doesn't have 4 studs to pull the team along.  I can just picture him pouting and whining on the sideline...

[Gregory Sager]

So you're telling me we played two of the worst teams in the midwest?  I thought beating a WIAC school on their home court in their tourney would be a good thing?

I didn't say anything of the sort. I simply gave you some of the pertinent information about the two teams (records, last season's records, preseason poll ranking, etc.), because you had said that you didn't know how good Bemidji State and UW-Stout were. I made no value judgments whatsoever. In fact, as Drake said I also went out of my way to point out that UPS beat Bemidji State by about the same margin that those other D2 teams had beaten the Beavers.