FB: Region 4 fan poll

[USee]

I think Witt, Wabash, DPU and Denison would be 7-10 point favorites against Olivet. I think OWU would be a pick 'em.

The pillow fight between the bottom of the NCAC and the bottom of the MIAA would be interesting.

That would assume the NCAC teams are all equal, which they are not.

Massey  puts the matchups against Olivet like this:

Witt -14
Wabash -7
Depauw pickem
Denison pickem
OWU +6

Hansen's final ratings went like this:

4. UMU
6. JCU
8. Wheaton
10. North Central
24. IWU
28. Witt
37. Wabash
53. Depauw
64. Franklin
68. Olivet
69. RHIT
79. Denison
87. OWU

[wally_wabash]

I think Witt, Wabash, DPU and Denison would be 7-10 point favorites against Olivet. I think OWU would be a pick 'em.

The pillow fight between the bottom of the NCAC and the bottom of the MIAA would be interesting.

That would assume the NCAC teams are all equal, which they are not.

They did all beat one another, so maybe not equal, per se, but there wasn't a whole lot of differentiation amongst the top 4 NCACs. 

[USee]

I think Witt, Wabash, DPU and Denison would be 7-10 point favorites against Olivet. I think OWU would be a pick 'em.

The pillow fight between the bottom of the NCAC and the bottom of the MIAA would be interesting.

That would assume the NCAC teams are all equal, which they are not.

They did all beat one another, so maybe not equal, per se, but there wasn't a whole lot of differentiation amongst the top 4 NCACs.

Well OWU beat Depauw by 22 and I don't hear anyone saying those two are equal. Hansen has a 50 team spread between #1 and #4 and Massey clearly differentiates. Depends on how you define "differentiation". I think you have to look at a team's entire resume to get a better picture. Depauw loses at home to OWU then beats Wabash on the road. One game results don't tell the whole story.

[wally_wabash]

I think Witt, Wabash, DPU and Denison would be 7-10 point favorites against Olivet. I think OWU would be a pick 'em.

The pillow fight between the bottom of the NCAC and the bottom of the MIAA would be interesting.

That would assume the NCAC teams are all equal, which they are not.

They did all beat one another, so maybe not equal, per se, but there wasn't a whole lot of differentiation amongst the top 4 NCACs.

Well OWU beat Depauw by 22 and I don't hear anyone saying those two are equal. Hansen has a 50 team spread between #1 and #4 and Massey clearly differentiates. Depends on how you define "differentiation". I think you have to look at a team's entire resume to get a better picture. Depauw loses at home to OWU then beats Wabash on the road. One game results don't tell the whole story.

Right, which is why I get confused by your logic sometimes.  You destroy teams for what you deem one bad loss.  There's more going on than just that one result. 

[USee]

I think Witt, Wabash, DPU and Denison would be 7-10 point favorites against Olivet. I think OWU would be a pick 'em.

The pillow fight between the bottom of the NCAC and the bottom of the MIAA would be interesting.

That would assume the NCAC teams are all equal, which they are not.

They did all beat one another, so maybe not equal, per se, but there wasn't a whole lot of differentiation amongst the top 4 NCACs.

Well OWU beat Depauw by 22 and I don't hear anyone saying those two are equal. Hansen has a 50 team spread between #1 and #4 and Massey clearly differentiates. Depends on how you define "differentiation". I think you have to look at a team's entire resume to get a better picture. Depauw loses at home to OWU then beats Wabash on the road. One game results don't tell the whole story.

Right, which is why I get confused by your logic sometimes.  You destroy teams for what you deem one bad loss.  There's more going on than just that one result.

Right, which is why I get confused by your logic. You elevate teams for what you deem one good win. There is indeed more going on. RHIT is a case study. One good win 2 bad losses, yet you fixate on the Franklin win and "couple" them. Faulty logic to me.

[Li'l Giant]

First, thanks to Wally for doing this again this season. I enjoy this poll, despite not being a huge part of the discussion this year. Work was crazy this season.

I'm the 3rd column from the right.

I agree with the pu pu platter at the bottom. I think any order in that 6-10 group can be justified.

[smedindy]

I think Hanson's model is too down on Denison, BTW. With only 10-games it's really hard to have a rigorous model, especially with the limited non-conference schedules.

[wally_wabash]

I think Witt, Wabash, DPU and Denison would be 7-10 point favorites against Olivet. I think OWU would be a pick 'em.

The pillow fight between the bottom of the NCAC and the bottom of the MIAA would be interesting.

That would assume the NCAC teams are all equal, which they are not.

They did all beat one another, so maybe not equal, per se, but there wasn't a whole lot of differentiation amongst the top 4 NCACs.

Well OWU beat Depauw by 22 and I don't hear anyone saying those two are equal. Hansen has a 50 team spread between #1 and #4 and Massey clearly differentiates. Depends on how you define "differentiation". I think you have to look at a team's entire resume to get a better picture. Depauw loses at home to OWU then beats Wabash on the road. One game results don't tell the whole story.

Right, which is why I get confused by your logic sometimes.  You destroy teams for what you deem one bad loss.  There's more going on than just that one result.

Right, which is why I get confused by your logic. You elevate teams for what you deem one good win. There is indeed more going on. RHIT is a case study. One good win 2 bad losses, yet you fixate on the Franklin win and "couple" them. Faulty logic to me.

Can't ignore that h2h win and just say Franklin is better than RHIT.  I mean you can as you've done, but I can't.  I think that's unfair to RHIT and the achievement of going on the road and winning the HCAC against the guys that have ruled the roost for decade.  That's a big deal.  It's a bigger deal than just not losing to Alma/Kalamazoo/Adrian/Albion. 

It's not faulty logic, it's just different than yours.  You judge teams heavily on who they lose to.  I judge teams heavily on who they beat.  I'm a carrot guy, you're a stick guy.  Just different POVs. 

[Captain_Joe08]

Uh are we doing a fanpoll this year?

[Dr. Acula]

I think we usually wait until a few days after Kickoff comes out to do the preseason poll.  Wally can confirm as my memory may be failing me!

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

For the national top 25 poll I've already posted to get things rolling but the deadline is after Kickoff is released

[wally_wabash]

Uh are we doing a fanpoll this year?

Totally.  I think is a really fun forum during the season so I don't think it's going anywhere.  Kickoff launches on Tuesday (please subscribe if you haven't yet!!), so maybe we can get preseason ballots in by 8/25? 

[Dr. Acula]

I just sent in my preseason ballot.  Thanks for running it again, Wally!  +k, sir. 

As for the ballot itself...I thought the top 4 were so close.  IMO there's no right or wrong order there.  I actually thought that it was very difficult to rank the bottom half again.   

[USee]

My ballot is in. I had 15 teams up for my 10 spots. Top 5 were pretty easy and picking the rest is a bit of a crapshoot but Kickoff definitely helped!

[smedindy]

I'm in. Had an office move so finally all settled.