NESCAC

[amh63]

FYI, on the Amherst Soccer website, there is about a minute or less video of NPL's winning kick.

[PaulNewman]

FYI, on the Amherst Soccer website, there is about a minute or less video of NPL's winning kick.

Unless I'm missing something that goal was 90% about the assist.  Heady (no pun intended) play.  Trinity allowed 3 headers in a row on that play inside the box and got punished for it.  Soccer is such a strange game.  You fight off corner after corner and short throw after short throw and eventually one bounces right or wrong (depending on which team you are on).

[Mr.Right]

Yes it was an excellent flick by Bean then I believe Lenhart had the best flick and NPL did his thing to finish it off...Well I have defended Amherst enough in one day(today) than I can handle. I am finished let someone else pull that weight.

[PaulNewman]

Who are the NESCAC all-Americans this year?

I know we are all immersed in the mighty Amherst but any further comments on this?  Even Mr. Right is quiet.......

No sure what you're looking for, and I'm sure this will give someone a chance at some more negative karma for me (although two people will have to wait for tomorrow since they apparently were offended by something in what seemed like pretty non-controversial posts earlier today). Anyways, I very much agree with you Tufts die-hards about how good Kayne is (and that's why I made him priority #1 in my scouting review of Tufts), but 1 goal and 2 assists for an entire season for an attacking mid are not AA numbers, even taking into account the usual retorts about playing less games and tougher competition.  For how great of a player he is those stats don't add up to a great year.  Compare to Hollingsworth, another high-profile attacking mid, with 18 goals and 6 assists. 

On the other hand, NPL may end up National POY even though he couldn't win NESCAC POY.  I don't think there is another player left in the Final Four who could get it over him even if Amherst loses.  It would have to be someone like Hollingsworth or another star from another team that already is out.

[PaulNewman]

Yes it was an excellent flick by Bean then I believe Lenhart had the best flick and NPL did his thing to finish it off...Well I have defended Amherst enough in one day(today) than I can handle. I am finished let someone else pull that weight.

Lenhart had the throw, then two players headed it and then the third header for the assist I think was Murray (I think?).

[Brother Flounder]

Who are the NESCAC all-Americans this year?

I know we are all immersed in the mighty Amherst but any further comments on this?  Even Mr. Right is quiet.......

No sure what you're looking for, and I'm sure this will give someone a chance at some more negative karma for me (although two people will have to wait for tomorrow since they apparently were offended by something in what seemed like pretty non-controversial posts earlier today). Anyways, I very much agree with you Tufts die-hards about how good Kayne is (and that's why I made him priority #1 in my scouting review of Tufts), but 1 goal and 2 assists for an entire season for an attacking mid are not AA numbers, even taking into account the usual retorts about playing less games and tougher competition.  For how great of a player he is those stats don't add up to a great year.  Compare to Hollingsworth, another high-profile attacking mid, with 18 goals and 6 assists. 

On the other hand, NPL may end up National POY even though he couldn't win NESCAC POY.  I don't think there is another player left in the Final Four who could get it over him even if Amherst loses.  It would have to be someone like Hollingsworth or another star from another team that already is out.

I don't give the negative karma.. you were the one who went on the rampage last year!  NPL could definitely win it.  Hollingsworth is fantastic.  He takes the penalty kicks, plays in an easier schedule and plays more games.  He definitely wouldn't have those stats in the NESCAC... fact is fact notwithstanding your attempt to disclaim it.  And I'm not comparing Kayne to Hollingsworth. 2 different players with 2 different skill sets. I have seen them both play. Hollingsworth has fanstastic speed. Kayne is better with the ball and has better vision and passing skills.....Recall Hoppenot got a second or third team AA last year as a forward with only 6 goals. 

[Brother Flounder]

Who are the NESCAC all-Americans this year?

I know we are all immersed in the mighty Amherst but any further comments on this?  Even Mr. Right is quiet.......

No sure what you're looking for, and I'm sure this will give someone a chance at some more negative karma for me (although two people will have to wait for tomorrow since they apparently were offended by something in what seemed like pretty non-controversial posts earlier today). Anyways, I very much agree with you Tufts die-hards about how good Kayne is (and that's why I made him priority #1 in my scouting review of Tufts), but 1 goal and 2 assists for an entire season for an attacking mid are not AA numbers, even taking into account the usual retorts about playing less games and tougher competition.  For how great of a player he is those stats don't add up to a great year.  Compare to Hollingsworth, another high-profile attacking mid, with 18 goals and 6 assists. 

On the other hand, NPL may end up National POY even though he couldn't win NESCAC POY.  I don't think there is another player left in the Final Four who could get it over him even if Amherst loses.  It would have to be someone like Hollingsworth or another star from another team that already is out.

By the way, what non-controversial quotes are you referring to? I didn't notice any...

[PaulNewman]

I don't buy your argument.  How do you know Hollingsworth doesn't have equal vision and ball/passing skills?  After all, the assists comparison is 6 to 2 in his favor.  And I'm not disclaiming what you want to include.  I'm saying that even factoring in more games and better competition (even though Wheaton has a pretty high SOS and played Loras x2, Wash U, North Park, Rose-Hulman, Carthage, and 4 NCAA games, etc), the numbers still don't add up.  Do you really think Hollingsworth would be limited to 3 goals and 2 assists in the NESCAC (and NCAA tournament)?  If Kayne had 5 goals and at least 7 or 8 assists then you might have an argument.  Kayne is an attacking mid, not a holding mid.  A player of his caliber should have more than 2 assists for a whole regular season, NESCAC tourney, and 3 NCAA games.  Great player, but the numbers aren't adding up even if all of the excuses are included.  I wouldn't have even commented on this at all but you seem very interested in the AA theme, and I assume you want honest discussion about it that goes just a bit beyond blind allegiances.

I posted a couple of posts in the other thread earlier today.

[Brother Flounder]

I don't buy your argument.  How do you know Hollingsworth doesn't have equal vision and ball/passing skills?  After all, the assists comparison is 6 to 2 in his favor.  And I'm not disclaiming what you want to include.  I'm saying that even factoring in more games and better competition (even though Wheaton has a pretty high SOS and played Loras x2, Wash U, North Park, Rose-Hulman, Carthage, and 4 NCAA games, etc), the numbers still don't add up.  Do you really think Hollingsworth would be limited to 3 goals and 2 assists in the NESCAC (and NCAA tournament)?  If Kayne had 5 goals and at least 7 or 8 assists then you might have an argument.  Kayne is an attacking mid, not a holding mid.  A player of his caliber should have more than 2 assists for a whole regular season, NESCAC tourney, and 3 NCAA games.  Great player, but the numbers aren't adding up even if all of the excuses are included.  I wouldn't have even commented on this at all but you seem very interested in the AA theme, and I assume you want honest discussion about it that goes just a bit beyond blind allegiances.

I posted a couple of posts in the other thread earlier today.

First of all, I have seen the 2 play in person. Have you?  That's how I base the comparison. Not on your numbers...You may have mentioned this before, or someone else, but Kayne made numerous passes for breakaways that were flubbed by other players. Should have had at least the amounts you claimed.  And, defensively, both are fantastic with multi-steals per game. Anyway, I see your points...just don't agree.  We can agree to disagree and I won't even give you a negative karma...

[PaulNewman]

Last point.  I think Amherst plays in the NESCAC.  NPL has 13 g, 5 a, Martin has 10 g, 5 a, Singer 6 g, 6 a, midfielder Orozco 4 g, 3 a, defender Bean 1 g, 5 a, and defender Lehnhart 6 a.

[Brother Flounder]

Last point.  I think Amherst plays in the NESCAC.  NPL has 13 g, 5 a, Martin has 10 g, 5 a, Singer 6 g, 6 a, midfielder Orozco 4 g, 3 a, defender Bean 1 g, 5 a, and defender Lehnhart 6 a.

I have seen Orozco play.  Not close to Kayne.  Martin and Singer are great players but don't have his talent. The NESCAC coaches felt the same way in the NESCAC voting for conference players. They see the players up close and personal so must think otherwise....Again, we can agree to disagree and I won't even give you a negative karma...

[PaulNewman]

Last point.  I think Amherst plays in the NESCAC.  NPL has 13 g, 5 a, Martin has 10 g, 5 a, Singer 6 g, 6 a, midfielder Orozco 4 g, 3 a, defender Bean 1 g, 5 a, and defender Lehnhart 6 a.

I have seen Orozco play.  Not close to Kayne.  Martin and Singer are great players but don't have his talent. The NESCAC coaches felt the same way in the NESCAC voting for conference players. They see the players up close and personal so must think otherwise....Again, we can agree to disagree and I won't even give you a negative karma...

And you missed the point again.  I'm agreeing with you that Kayne is one of the top 2-3 players in the league.  You've suggested that the league itself is a huge limiting factor.  If these lesser players above can rack up some numbers then it's fair to make numbers a relevant factor in how great of a season someone had.  If it's a done deal for you why did you ask again for more discussion?

[Brother Flounder]

Last point.  I think Amherst plays in the NESCAC.  NPL has 13 g, 5 a, Martin has 10 g, 5 a, Singer 6 g, 6 a, midfielder Orozco 4 g, 3 a, defender Bean 1 g, 5 a, and defender Lehnhart 6 a.

I have seen Orozco play.  Not close to Kayne.  Martin and Singer are great players but don't have his talent. The NESCAC coaches felt the same way in the NESCAC voting for conference players. They see the players up close and personal so must think otherwise....Again, we can agree to disagree and I won't even give you a negative karma...

And you missed the point again.  I'm agreeing with you that Kayne is one of the top 2-3 players in the league.  You've suggested that the league itself is a huge limiting factor.  If these lesser players above can rack up some numbers then it's fair to make numbers a relevant factor in how great of a season someone had.  If it's a done deal for you why did you ask again for more discussion?

Done... Let it go.....

[letsGOswans!]

All I'll add is if Kayne  is in the discussion even though he lacks the stats then Devlin must be. In my opinion he is the best midfielder in this league.

[Nutmeg]

All I'll add is if Kayne  is in the discussion even though he lacks the stats then Devlin must be. In my opinion he is the best midfielder in this league.

Kayne and Devlin are fantastic players both worthy of the recognition...