FB: Southern Athletic Association

[jknezek]

Berry fans

Congrats on your new ranking. Number 14! Nice to see some new teams up there. Of course, I don't mind " old" Mount Union still up there. How about a Mount - Berry playoff game? I think that would be neat! Best to you guys on the rest of the season. Hey, my first loyalty is to the Purple Raiders, being a graduate, but I also root for some other teams. Berry is one of them. Go Vikings! ☠🏈

Thanks, but give us a couple more years to get ready to take on Mount Union, certainly the cream of the crop. But I truly feel we are a program on the rise

I hope Berry boosts the non-conference schedule to one worthy of a program on the rise. I understand scheduling LaGrange, but get out of the local area and play someone in the rest of Division III. How about someone like Wittenberg?

Takes 2 to tango. That's a long ride. 500 miles even on TES. Other than a trip to Wash U back in 2009 and 2007, Witt's OOC has been pretty local. Olivet or Alma at 250-300 miles seems to be the outlier and that goes back to the mid 90s. Capital has been up 4 times at 50 miles. The number of good schools Witt would drive past seems a bit silly.

Berry is just a difficult island to be on, and with expensive trips to Texas every year, plus Arkansas every other, it's asking a lot to shell out for a distance OOC as well. Berry really needs the ODAC or USASAC to develop a strong team.

I am fully aware of how scheduling happens. But Berry can't rely on someone else to help it build its program. Understood that Witt has been local, but it doesn't have to be. If you want to play football with the big boys -- go find someone bigger to play. Gotta do what you can to make that happen rather than just play on your island the whole time.

Why? Berry right now plays a more diverse schedule than just about anyone else. The SAA has a few high quality teams year in and out. Through the AQ they have access to the big boys in the end.

Look deeper and I don't think Berry needs to schedule that top tier OOC to build the program. They'll get good, balanced competition every year in the SAA and, if they go undefeated, they are most likely to get paired with the USASAC winner in round 1, probably at home if undefeated. That's a winnable game and, due to being on an island, they are likely to get a very strong round 2 opponent.

Berry is actually in a great situation right now. Winning the SAA, especially going undefeated like last year, makes for a very favorable environment in which to grow. Losing a national level game in the OOC only jeopardizes the winnable first round home game. And would you rather have that big boy at the beginning of the season, where it can damage you, or at the end of the season when it's all or nothing?

Significant possibility of 12 games, including a home playoff, and a national level opponent at the end? Most DIII conference winners be real happy with a situation likely to produce that result.

[Pat Coleman]

Significant possibility of 12 games, including a home playoff, and a national level opponent at the end? Most DIII conference winners be real happy with a situation likely to produce that result.

If that's their only ambition, OK. Who's to say that they can't do better?

[BerryViking92]

Berry fans

Congrats on your new ranking. Number 14! Nice to see some new teams up there. Of course, I don't mind " old" Mount Union still up there. How about a Mount - Berry playoff game? I think that would be neat! Best to you guys on the rest of the season. Hey, my first loyalty is to the Purple Raiders, being a graduate, but I also root for some other teams. Berry is one of them. Go Vikings! ☠🏈

Thanks, but give us a couple more years to get ready to take on Mount Union, certainly the cream of the crop. But I truly feel we are a program on the rise

I hope Berry boosts the non-conference schedule to one worthy of a program on the rise. I understand scheduling LaGrange, but get out of the local area and play someone in the rest of Division III. How about someone like Wittenberg?

Takes 2 to tango. That's a long ride. 500 miles even on TES. Other than a trip to Wash U back in 2009 and 2007, Witt's OOC has been pretty local. Olivet or Alma at 250-300 miles seems to be the outlier and that goes back to the mid 90s. Capital has been up 4 times at 50 miles. The number of good schools Witt would drive past seems a bit silly.

Berry is just a difficult island to be on, and with expensive trips to Texas every year, plus Arkansas every other, it's asking a lot to shell out for a distance OOC as well. Berry really needs the ODAC or USASAC to develop a strong team.

I am fully aware of how scheduling happens. But Berry can't rely on someone else to help it build its program. Understood that Witt has been local, but it doesn't have to be. If you want to play football with the big boys -- go find someone bigger to play. Gotta do what you can to make that happen rather than just play on your island the whole time.

Why? Berry right now plays a more diverse schedule than just about anyone else. The SAA has a few high quality teams year in and out. Through the AQ they have access to the big boys in the end.

Look deeper and I don't think Berry needs to schedule that top tier OOC to build the program. They'll get good, balanced competition every year in the SAA and, if they go undefeated, they are most likely to get paired with the USASAC winner in round 1, probably at home if undefeated. That's a winnable game and, due to being on an island, they are likely to get a very strong round 2 opponent.

Berry is actually in a great situation right now. Winning the SAA, especially going undefeated like last year, makes for a very favorable environment in which to grow. Losing a national level game in the OOC only jeopardizes the winnable first round home game. And would you rather have that big boy at the beginning of the season, where it can damage you, or at the end of the season when it's all or nothing?

Significant possibility of 12 games, including a home playoff, and a national level opponent at the end? Most DIII conference winners be real happy with a situation likely to produce that result.

I agree.  And Maryville was always a good game at the beginning of the season ... until this year (really what happened to them??).  Our program is still so young.  IF we keep winning at this level, I would expect to see a scheduling move in the next few years.  But right now I am fine with what we are doing.  I believe our coach and administration have handled the football program almost  perfectly since day 1.  We are a program on the rise, one step at a time.

[jknezek]

Significant possibility of 12 games, including a home playoff, and a national level opponent at the end? Most DIII conference winners be real happy with a situation likely to produce that result.

If that's their only ambition, OK. Who's to say that they can't do better?

Why do they need 2 national level games a year to get better? They weren't quite at STU's level last year. No shame there. There aren't many that are. But the year before they were even further back. And the year before that they were nowhere near the scene. Their growth is good doing what they are doing.

They don't need that top tier game in the OOC to move forward. In fact, I think it would do more harm then good. They keep building a rep of being a DIII playoff competitor and they are going to pull better and better kids from a football rich, DIII sparse area. They start backsliding and that job gets harder. Going undefeated, winning a playoff game, these things help way more than saying "we lost to #16 Wittenberg by 3" or even, "we beat #16 Wittenberg by 10". That's not going to resonate like the undefeated banner and a playoff win or two per year.

[MUC57]

BerryViking92

For what it's worth, I like your thinking. As you said, one step at a time. Go get 'em Vikings! ☠🏈😀
Also gave you a +k for your thoughts.

[Pat Coleman]

They don't need that top tier game in the OOC to move forward. In fact, I think it would do more harm then good.

That's good -- because Wittenberg isn't in the top tier. That's why I recommended them and not Mount Union or Mary Hardin-Baylor.

I agree.  And Maryville was always a good game at the beginning of the season ... until this year (really what happened to them??). 

And that's OK -- it was great for a program still bringing its first class through.

[MUC57]

jknezek

You certainly have a much better analysis of this discussion than I ever could. Your comments make sense to me and sum up my feelings (if I could only articulate them that well).
How about a +k for you and a big Go Generals. ☠🏈

[jknezek]

jknezek

You certainly have a much better analysis of this discussion than I ever could. Your comments make sense to me and sum up my feelings (if I could only articulate them that well).
How about a +k for you and a big Go Generals. ☠🏈

Thanks. I think my Generals are going to need it... The offense was dominated this weekend by RMC's defense. It was difficult to watch.

[BerryCollegeFan]

I like the position they are in now,  Obviously Maryville was not the schedule positive they have been in past years.  It wouldn't surprise me if a team might request a game with Berry in the next year or two.  How would a D2 team look on the schedule?

But on the other hand, it looks like all the SAA teams are picking it up this season.  The competition seems to be better (most games).  I think it would help SAA if all the teams had better ooc opponents, but the records were not really bad this year.  with 9 team conference and 8 games, there are only 2 spots for ooc games.  Overall the footprint is pretty wide.  Maybe the competition can pick it up as well...

this year SAA was 13-5 (6-3 H) (7-2 A)

Victories over:
LaGrange (2); McMurry; Belhaven; Kenyon; Maryville (2); Hanover; Illinois College; Lyon; Westminster (Mo.); Rose-Hulman; Huntingdon (team records 13-33)

Loses:
Southwestern Assemblies; Washington and Lee; Wayland Baptist; Texas Lutheran; Hardin-Simmons (these teams are 12-9 on the season)

Just hard to make it work with high $ travel and a budget that is still growing into itself...

[Pat Coleman]

I like the position they are in now,  Obviously Maryville was not the schedule positive they have been in past years.  It wouldn't surprise me if a team might request a game with Berry in the next year or two.  How would a D2 team look on the schedule?

It wouldn't help the selection process. Playing non-D3 schools is a high-risk situation for playoff contenders. It could well provide quality competition, though.

[Ron Boerger]

[...]

Victories over:
LaGrange (2); McMurray; Belhaven; Kenyon; Maryville (2); Hanover; Illinois College; Lyon; Westminster (Mo.); Rose-Hulman; Huntingdon (team records 13-33)

[....]

Note:  It's McMurry (a school in TX).  There's another D3 school named Macmurray in MO.

[BerryCollegeFan]

this year SAA was 13-5 (6-3 H) (7-2 A)

Victories over:
LaGrange (2); McMurry; Belhaven; Kenyon; Maryville (2); Hanover; Illinois College; Lyon; Westminster (Mo.); Rose-Hulman; Huntingdon (team records 13-33)

Loses:
Southwestern Assemblies; Washington and Lee; Wayland Baptist; Texas Lutheran; Hardin-Simmons (these teams are 12-9 on the season)

Is it too early to find a SOS comparison?

[wally_wabash]

this year SAA was 13-5 (6-3 H) (7-2 A)

Victories over:
LaGrange (2); McMurry; Belhaven; Kenyon; Maryville (2); Hanover; Illinois College; Lyon; Westminster (Mo.); Rose-Hulman; Huntingdon (team records 13-33)

Loses:
Southwestern Assemblies; Washington and Lee; Wayland Baptist; Texas Lutheran; Hardin-Simmons (these teams are 12-9 on the season)

Is it too early to find a SOS comparison?

Still a bit early for the NCAA SOS number to be super meaningful, but based on the SAA's out of conference record, my instinct tells me that this league's teams will trend north of the .500 mark which is a good place to be.  It could have set up really well, but with Huntingdon and RHIT performing below expectations, the league isn't getting as much boost from those two as I would have thought five weeks ago.  I think the trouble for an SAA runner up in the Pool C game is that I don't think there are going to be any out of conference results against regionally ranked teams.  And then without those RRO results, you kind of have your runner up in the same mixer with at-large teams from the PAC and CC (operating on the assumption here that the UMHB/HSU loser will be the top ranked at-large team in the region).  That's a tough spot to be in if you're looking at avenues for a second team from the SAA in the tournament. 

[Ron Boerger]

this year SAA was 13-5 (6-3 H) (7-2 A)

Victories over:
LaGrange (2); McMurry; Belhaven; Kenyon; Maryville (2); Hanover; Illinois College; Lyon; Westminster (Mo.); Rose-Hulman; Huntingdon (team records 13-33)

Loses:
Southwestern Assemblies; Washington and Lee; Wayland Baptist; Texas Lutheran; Hardin-Simmons (these teams are 12-9 on the season)

Is it too early to find a SOS comparison?

Still a bit early for the NCAA SOS number to be super meaningful, but based on the SAA's out of conference record, my instinct tells me that this league's teams will trend north of the .500 mark which is a good place to be.  It could have set up really well, but with Huntingdon and RHIT performing below expectations, the league isn't getting as much boost from those two as I would have thought five weeks ago.  I think the trouble for an SAA runner up in the Pool C game is that I don't think there are going to be any out of conference results against regionally ranked teams.  And then without those RRO results, you kind of have your runner up in the same mixer with at-large teams from the PAC and CC (operating on the assumption here that the UMHB/HSU loser will be the top ranked at-large team in the region).  That's a tough spot to be in if you're looking at avenues for a second team from the SAA in the tournament.

The only RRO possibility would be Trinity's loss to Hardin-Simmons, but it's hard to imagine any scenario where that comes in to play. 

[Ralph Turner]

...and Trinity's winning the SAA helps HSU, IF they are Pool C.