BB: Top Teams in West Region

[Spence]

When you are looking at the number of unique teams played by conference membere, by which the OWP/OOWP and SOS are calulated, you get the same 20 teams for the ASC and the Texas teams.

The West coast teams may get that to 25 with the west coast snow birds, but those have not been  in-region.

Again I'll point to the lengths other programs have to go to get games in and see West teams starting early Feb and only playing a few games a week. IMO there are things that could be done that aren't right now.

[108 Stitches]

I am sure things could be done differently Spence if the only variable was baseball. We seem to forget on this board that these are students first. (DIII at that) There are academic considerations, conference issues, travel costs, and a bunch of other higher priority problems that come way before a DIII baseball program. There is no way the administration of any highly ranked university (academic)  is going to let a baseball program take precedence over academics, costs, school schedules, etc.

As you posted previously all areas in the country have different issues.  The West teams have theirs - It is just the way it is.

[TexasBB]

Anything that can be done has to be done before confence play starts. So you are limited to a couple of weekends in February and maybee the first week of March. The best bet is Arizona where the wheather is normally cooperative. North Texas in February and early March is iffy at best.  Once conference play starts the West Region teams are issolated in their zones for the most part due to the distances.

Pre-confernce play is not (IMO) a very good judge of how good a team is playing in April. That is true for the northeren schools going to Florida as well. The West region is just way too spread out for them to play against each other. Linfield and UTT for example are not likely to ever play each other unless it is in a pre-conference tournament or in the regional. The Div III schools just don't have the travel budgets to do a regular home and away annual play as DIV I schools do. I would like to see more of it but reality gets in the way.

TexasBB

[Spence]

Do western schools not have spring break?

[Spence]

I am sure things could be done differently Spence if the only variable was baseball. We seem to forget on this board that these are students first. (DIII at that) There are academic considerations, conference issues, travel costs, and a bunch of other higher priority problems that come way before a DIII baseball program. There is no way the administration of any highly ranked university (academic)  is going to let a baseball program take precedence over academics, costs, school schedules, etc.

As you posted previously all areas in the country have different issues.  The West teams have theirs - It is just the way it is.

Difference is people from the other parts of the country don't complain nearly as much about their issues...they deal with them and overcome them. And the way they do that most is by getting on a bus.

Your statements sound like a holier-than-thou indictment of other programs that travel more, take finals on the road during tournaments, etc. It would be insulting except that it's so patently ridiculous. It sounds like you don't think teams back east that are playing 6-7 games a week sometimes care about academics.

Whatever, I don't really care and I don't think the NCAA is going to take pity on teams that don't do all they can to compete. I'm glad there is at least one or two people on this board that can understand and admit (sad that it has to be that) that schools out west don't have it too bad. Hell, you have schools from back east that have barely been outside coming across the country to play true road games with NO return trip! I don't see how it gets better than that.

Every problem is an opportunity to improve by way of the solution.

[BigPoppa]

Just pointing out that my high school team has YET to play a game and has only been outside three days so far... The loss of the MetroDome next year is really going to hit the midwest teams hard. They are all going to have to travel South to play which may eliminate some of the great early season matchups (St. Thomas and St. Scholastica vs the top of the half of the WIAC for example).

[Jack Parkman]

Do western schools not have spring break?

Speaking only for the SCAIC but they play conference games during this time.  The SCIAC added 4 round-robin games this year which pushes their conference schedule to 28 games.  It looks like the addition of the conference tournament eliminated 1 regular season game for a total of 39 games.  Only having to find 11 non-conference games should not be too tough and it all starts in early Feb.  There are 2 different Arizona tournaments to get games in and you can easily play 4-5 games in those.  I am a West homer but I also see how big of a luxury the West has when it comes to scheduling.  Fundraising can be done, it's just a matter of IF it is done.

[Spence]

Just pointing out that my high school team has YET to play a game and has only been outside three days so far... The loss of the MetroDome next year is really going to hit the midwest teams hard. They are all going to have to travel South to play which may eliminate some of the great early season matchups (St. Thomas and St. Scholastica vs the top of the half of the WIAC for example).

Yeah, it will be interesting to see how that's handled. But it will be. Maybe they play more games down south, maybe they meet somewhere further south to play. A round robin weekend between several of the regional powers would be really fun and great competition for everyone.

But at least for the MIAC, once the season starts most of the league has it pretty easy for travel...well other than Concordia-Moorhead.

Hopefully the winter won't be quite as slow to end next year.

[Whatagame]

Take a look at the 2012 DOE data regarding institutionally-funded "game day expenses" by participant, by sport.  Of the 9 NWC schools, the median game-day funding per player, for the season was $2,679.  The highest funding school spent $4,400, the lowest, $1,470.  Most NWC teams do a reasonable amount of air travel to get games in.

By contrast, Chapman funded $841 per player.  Pomona, with a $1 billion + endowment, funded $862.

It really only requires two well-planned trips with airfare to get 8-10 quality games in.  The money required to do this is chicken-feed in most instances to these institutions, its just a choice.

[Spence]

Take a look at the 2012 DOE data regarding institutionally-funded "game day expenses" by participant, by sport.  Of the 9 NWC schools, the median game-day funding per player, for the season was $2,679.  The highest funding school spent $4,400, the lowest, $1,470.  Most NWC teams do a reasonable amount of air travel to get games in.

By contrast, Chapman funded $841 per player.  Pomona, with a $1 billion + endowment, funded $862.

It really only requires two well-planned trips with airfare to get 8-10 quality games in.  The money required to do this is chicken-feed in most instances to these institutions, its just a choice.

Can you link this, please? I'm kind of curious to see other schools too...not just in the West.

[TexasBB]

DIV III sports are extra curricular activities. A college has alot of budgetary issues with sports being just one of them. Most schools want to be fair to all the sports. So spending on travel for a baseball team will likely mean spending on travel for the softball team or tennis team etc etc.  With the pressure to keep costs down travel budgets are being cut. Again reality sets in and limits things.

[108 Stitches]

Can you link this, please? I'm kind of curious to see other schools too...not just in the West.

Here is the link, however the data here is very suspect. If you look at some of the D1 programs they spend a lot more than what is reported here. This was hashed out on the rivals board some time ago and there were lots of questions regarding its accuracy.

http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/Index.aspx

Regarding your other comments, I am not taking a holier than thou approach, I'm just saying administrators are not going to allow teams to have 6-7 game per week schedules when they can do 4 game schedules as it offers a better balance. It just won't happen. I really don't know how a kid in the NE can take a heavy science, pre-med  or engineering major and get it done in 4 years with those schedules. I know some do it, and my hats off to them, but why would an administrator allow this for a sports team? Just saying it won't happen.

[Spence]

Can you link this, please? I'm kind of curious to see other schools too...not just in the West.

Here is the link, however the data here is very suspect. If you look at some of the D1 programs they spend a lot more than what is reported here. This was hashed out on the rivals board some time ago and there were lots of questions regarding its accuracy.

http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/Index.aspx

Regarding your other comments, I am not taking a holier than thou approach, I'm just saying administrators are not going to allow teams to have 6-7 game per week schedules when they can do 4 game schedules as it offers a better balance. It just won't happen. I really don't know how a kid in the NE can take a heavy science, pre-med  or engineering major and get it done in 4 years with those schedules. I know some do it, and my hats off to them, but why would an administrator allow this for a sports team? Just saying it won't happen.

OK I apparently don't know how to use that link. I want data by individual school, not by conference or anything, and I can't figure out how to get it that way.

Obviously it will happen because it does happen. But you AGAIN insinuate that administrators are being lax or remiss in their duties by allowing teams to play that schedule.

Maybe northern and eastern kids are just smarter and manage their time better. Just as asinine as what you're putting out here.

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it can't work, which it clearly does.

Every year this board see this whining about the same thing. Either do something about it, or don't...but it gets really old hearing it every year.

Heck you don't even have anything to whine about yet...the best team in the country is in the West and is proving that you can travel in midseason because they're doing it next week.

[ILVBB]

Spence - don't forget the impact of Title IX. You can not always just spend more for travel without looking at the consiquences of Title IX. Let's just say a west team wants to take an additional trip to get 3-4 more in region games; so just fund raise. Flights, hotels, ground transportation and food a weekend can run $15K to $20k. Now let's factor in Title IX when the school makeup is 60% women and 40% men. The fund raising is now $20K for the baseball team and $30K for the women's program to ensure compliance with Title IX.

The effective cost -- $45 to $50K for that extra trip.

[108 Stitches]

Spence who is whining? We have an intelligent discussion and then you start throwing around insults. It really is not necessary.

Regarding the link go to "get data for one institution" and you can look up schools there.