Pool C -- 2012

[AO]

What, you want teams from the NEFC to fly around everywhere to play the WIAC or SCIAC? They have very limited travel budgets as it is! Be sensible - this is D3 and you tend to play teams in your neighborhood.

You can't complain about not being able to find good teams if you're Bridgewater.  You don't need to fly to Wisconsin to find someone who can beat you.  The NEFC is attempting to wall itself off from the rest of D3 in order to insure more victories for its schools with the side effect of giving them a greater shot at at-large bids.

[ExTartanPlayer]

I want to say something obvious, but it's worth reminding ourselves at this juncture.

Every team in Pool C had a chance to make it into the playoffs through Pool A. 

Yes, we can quibble all day that some teams played harder schedules than other teams did, or play in a conference with a powerhouse that no one can beat...but the ultimate purpose of the playoffs is to crown a national champion.  If you are the best team in the nation, the vast majority of the time you will win your conference and qualify through Pool A (although it weakens my argument, I must acknowledge that last year Alabama lost to LSU in the regular season and then won a rematch for the FBS national title; that's a discussion for another time and place).

Once we're arguing the merits of various 8-2 teams against one another, we're probably past the point of teams that are realistic contenders to take the national crown, since each of them has at least one major wart (either a blowout loss to a really good playoff team, or any loss to a non-playoff team) which suggests that they are unlikely to go all the way.

Yes, I think it's ridiculous that Bridgewater State got in, and  I'd have much preferred to see Ohio Wesleyan, Concordia-Moorhead, Lycoming, and several others receive that last Pool C bid in their stead.  But ultimately, I can live with our system.  You don't like it?  Get in through Pool A.

[AO]

What, you want teams from the NEFC to fly around everywhere to play the WIAC or SCIAC? They have very limited travel budgets as it is! Be sensible - this is D3 and you tend to play teams in your neighborhood. Add to that many teams have fairly locked in conference schedules without a lot of flexibility and you grab games when you can.

Your implication, AO, is also like past implications that some teams and leagues 'dodge' games. There are myriad factors in developing a schedule and as discussed before, a 'tough' schedule for three years down the road may not pan out for several reasons.

So tell me, please, how teams with limited travel budgets and limited non-conference opportunities can all fill their schedules with elite non-conference games where those 'elite' also have the same budget and schedule limitations....

My implication is that if you don't schedule that tougher competition, don't expect a pool C bid.  You certainly don't have to schedule the better competition, you will still have an opportunity through pool A.

[USee]

I also don't think the scheduling issue is linear for all teams. I know for a fact that Wheaton could schedule Mt Unioin or UWW, etc for non-conference games but they choose not to because the CCIW is such a tough conference. They try to schedule to prepare their team for a brutal conference slate while giving them the best chance to get in with 1 or 2 losses. This year it bit them as they had Luther, Benedictine and Albion. The reality is if they had beaten Albion they are in the playoffs with 1 loss. But if they had beaten Bethel, UWP, or Coe, instead of Luther, their SOS may have given them a chance at the end of the selections yesterday.

The system rewards teams with weaker schedules. But if your goal is to simply get into the playoffs you can get there in a weak conference with a weak schedule. If you want to win a few games and have a chance in the playoffs, you need to prepare against tougher opponents. CCIW teams get that prep during the season and I believe their success during the post season comes from that (we will test that theory this year!) NATHcon teams do not benefit from playing weak scheduls. CUC is going to get a beat down this weekend of epic proportions from a 2 loss Bethel team IMO.

It really is a two-edged sword.

[AO]

This year it bit them as they had Luther, Benedictine and Albion. The reality is if they had beaten Albion they are in the playoffs with 1 loss. But if they had beaten Bethel, UWP, or Coe, instead of Luther, their SOS may have given them a chance at the end of the selections yesterday.

exactly.  The D3 philosophy should encourage the scheduling of a wide variety of opponents.  The way the system is set up, you want to win the most possible games.  D3 should be about more than winning/losing.  If Wheaton schedules Mount Union, for purposes of pool C, a 7-3 Wheaton should be considered to be an 8-2 Wheaton when comparing them to everyone else who didn't play Mount.

[smedindy]

What, you want teams from the NEFC to fly around everywhere to play the WIAC or SCIAC? They have very limited travel budgets as it is! Be sensible - this is D3 and you tend to play teams in your neighborhood.

You can't complain about not being able to find good teams if you're Bridgewater.  You don't need to fly to Wisconsin to find someone who can beat you.  The NEFC is attempting to wall itself off from the rest of D3 in order to insure more victories for its schools with the side effect of giving them a greater shot at at-large bids.

Bridgewater faced a pretty good LL team in their non-conference slate and then played two other NEFC conference teams, one if which has a decent reputation (Endicott). Who is close by for them that has a game to give and can be reasonable for travel expenses? It can't be any NESCAC teams, for sure.  And you'd scream and holler if they scheduled any ECFC teams.

Plus scheduling is a two-way street. You have to find opponents that WANT to play them.

The way the system is set up is to provide opportunities for student-athletes to participate in the post-season and reward teams for success. It's unfair to tar some teams by claiming they WANT to play weaker schedules when there is no guarantee for a post-season unless you WIN you league, and really unfair to have knee-jerk reactions in this, the most anomalous year of all.

You cant penalize teams because they can't afford to play a Mt. Union or some team that requires an overnight stay. Many of these New England state schools have a very limited budget for travel and expenses (so I read last year) and thus can't venture out too far from home out of their conference.

[AO]

What, you want teams from the NEFC to fly around everywhere to play the WIAC or SCIAC? They have very limited travel budgets as it is! Be sensible - this is D3 and you tend to play teams in your neighborhood.

You can't complain about not being able to find good teams if you're Bridgewater.  You don't need to fly to Wisconsin to find someone who can beat you.  The NEFC is attempting to wall itself off from the rest of D3 in order to insure more victories for its schools with the side effect of giving them a greater shot at at-large bids.

Bridgewater faced a pretty good LL team in their non-conference slate and then played two other NEFC conference teams, one if which has a decent reputation (Endicott). Who is close by for them that has a game to give and can be reasonable for travel expenses? It can't be any NESCAC teams, for sure.  And you'd scream and holler if they scheduled any ECFC teams.

Plus scheduling is a two-way street. You have to find opponents that WANT to play them.

The way the system is set up is to provide opportunities for student-athletes to participate in the post-season and reward teams for success. It's unfair to tar some teams by claiming they WANT to play weaker schedules when there is no guarantee for a post-season unless you WIN you league, and really unfair to have knee-jerk reactions in this, the most anomalous year of all.

You cant penalize teams because they can't afford to play a Mt. Union or some team that requires an overnight stay. Many of these New England state schools have a very limited budget for travel and expenses (so I read last year) and thus can't venture out too far from home out of their conference.

Salve Regina managed to play Union and Montclair State.   There are games out there for teams who want to be considered for pool C despite being in a area of the country with a lot of poor D3 teams.

[Bishop#1fan]

Hey Mr. HSCOACH........Witt plays in the same WEAK Conf.!!!!!!.....playing the same WEAK teams AND have a lower SOS than OWU and always get talked about and put on a pedestal?!!!!!...Yes I ask this Friday and got no response and it doesn't suprise me!!!!!!....OWU SOS .511 and WITT .428?!!!!!!...what will the excuse be in the coming years when OWU pees on your Witt parade?!!!!!!.....I'm sure it will be officials or field conditions or we didn't get the right nutrients that day!!!!!....this whole process is a losers joke!!!!....you have a conference that does it 2 diff ways in four regends!!!!......continue to let the moroons run the ship and this is what we get!!!!!

[smedindy]

Salve's not a state school. What I read last year is that the MA publics really don't have a lot of budget flexibility.

[smedindy]

Bishop #1 Fan,

1. There are answers all over this thread AND on the NCAC board on why Witt was the AQ. We've kept responding and responding.
2. HSCoach is an OAC (I am assuming Mt. Union) fan and holds Witt with a low amount of regard.
3. I have no idea what the rest of your rant was. Can you take a breath and use spell check?

[MonroviaCat]

Hey Mr. HSCOACH........Witt plays in the same WEAK Conf.!!!!!!.....playing the same WEAK teams AND have a lower SOS than OWU and always get talked about and put on a pedestal?!!!!!...Yes I ask this Friday and got no response and it doesn't suprise me!!!!!!....OWU SOS .511 and WITT .428?!!!!!!...what will the excuse be in the coming years when OWU pees on your Witt parade?!!!!!!.....I'm sure it will be officials or field conditions or we didn't get the right nutrients that day!!!!!....this whole process is a losers joke!!!!....you have a conference that does it 2 diff ways in four regends!!!!......continue to let the moroons run the ship and this is what we get!!!!!

Classic.   

[pg04]

Hey Mr. HSCOACH........Witt plays in the same WEAK Conf.!!!!!!.....playing the same WEAK teams AND have a lower SOS than OWU and always get talked about and put on a pedestal?!!!!!...Yes I ask this Friday and got no response and it doesn't suprise me!!!!!!....OWU SOS .511 and WITT .428?!!!!!!...what will the excuse be in the coming years when OWU pees on your Witt parade?!!!!!!.....I'm sure it will be officials or field conditions or we didn't get the right nutrients that day!!!!!....this whole process is a losers joke!!!!....you have a conference that does it 2 diff ways in four regends!!!!......continue to let the moroons run the ship and this is what we get!!!!!

Please educate yourself on the system before coming on here and bitching and moaning about the process. It's obvious what happened, and you have been told (as previously mentioned) numerous times.

Also, please educate yourself in general. Thanks.

[MonroviaCat]

So Pat, I know your busy and all....but have you considered a time-out box for "serial stupid" in addition to "serial smiter"?    Just sayin.

[emma17]

Hey Mr. HSCOACH........Witt plays in the same WEAK Conf.!!!!!!.....playing the same WEAK teams AND have a lower SOS than OWU and always get talked about and put on a pedestal?!!!!!...Yes I ask this Friday and got no response and it doesn't suprise me!!!!!!....OWU SOS .511 and WITT .428?!!!!!!...what will the excuse be in the coming years when OWU pees on your Witt parade?!!!!!!.....I'm sure it will be officials or field conditions or we didn't get the right nutrients that day!!!!!....this whole process is a losers joke!!!!....you have a conference that does it 2 diff ways in four regends!!!!......continue to let the moroons run the ship and this is what we get!!!!!

Bish- I appreciate your gusto. 

[Bishop#1fan]

Hey Mr. Road Toad!!!!!.....Seems that allot more of us"STUPID" people have the same questions and aren't getting ANY EDUCATED answers that make sense!!!!...I am done with you!!!!