Pool C -- 2014

[D3MAFAN]

If I am remembering right, Wally's last analysis last year had Wabash getting in as the last team. That was based on the criteria and what we knew on Saturday night which included projecting final rankings based on that day's results.  I remember most of us thinking it was a pretty reasonable analysis (this year's efforts confirm those assumptions). So what changed? If I recall, we didn't foresee SJF jumping ahead of  the team above them (Endicott? or was that 2011?) in the final rankings. What we also didn't forsee is a nuanced shifting of the interpretation of the criteria with new committee members/Chairs. We know this year's chair is the same as last year so surprises may be mitigated but I am interested, especially after Saturday's games, what surprises, if any, we can anticipate that would change something.

All things being equal can we safely assume Bethel is behind Platteville if they both win, can we assume Centre doesn't get bumped up?

You are correct- last year I did pick Wabash as my last team in, but I couched that selection by saying that there were sound, criteria-based reasons to pick either team.  It certainly wasn't an obvious choice and I don't have beef with that choice. 

I know we've mentioned this a little bit earlier as we hypothesized about Wheaotn's chances to make the field as an at-large when their league didn't help them out with winning non-league games and/or getting a third team ranked.  Sometimes you can be a good team that plays in a league like that (or any 10-team league really)...where you can be really good, lose to the one ranked team on your schedule, and get left out.  The criteria don't do much for evaluating the quality of a team, only the quality of one or two wins/losses in a 10-game schedule.  Muhlenberg,, Thomas More, Emory & Henry all fall into this category this year.  Centre also, but they are a special case because they haven't lost at all.

I wondering with the continue growth of DIII football teams, what do you think will be the next stage regarding DIII playoffs. Do we keep it simple and have just conference champions (assuming we get to 32 AQ conferences)? Or, do extend a weekend and have play-in games? As we all know, the best 32 teams never make the playoff.

[smedindy]

I think 32 is the right number. I doubt if the powers that be will expand it past that unless the NAIA schools flee in droves.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

It will remain at 32 ... because it would take a change in the Division III rules to grow any bigger. Football is capped at 32. And honestly... where in the world are you going to find another week to fit in an extra week of playoffs? And growth in Division III is actually slowing a bit, which isn't a bad thing to be honest.

[SaintsFAN]

I wondering with the continue growth of DIII football teams, what do you think will be the next stage regarding DIII playoffs. Do we keep it simple and have just conference champions (assuming we get to 32 AQ conferences)? Or, do extend a weekend and have play-in games? As we all know, the best 32 teams never make the playoff.

We do have play in games already.  11 weeks of them.

[hazzben]

It will remain at 32 ... because it would take a change in the Division III rules to grow any bigger. Football is capped at 32. And honestly... where in the world are you going to find another week to fit in an extra week of playoffs? And growth in Division III is actually slowing a bit, which isn't a bad thing to be honest.

To be honest, the growth is the thing that I think needs to be capped. If we are locked in at 32 teams, we should lock in the number of schools in D3. Just a thought...

[ITH radio]

And maybe send 2-4 (purple) teams up to D2 or 1AA

[SaintsFAN]

I hate crap like this.  There's a website where you plug in two teams and they run results of games to show one is better than the other.  Its stupid - and doesn't prove anything.  I wouldn't even take consistency from that. 

Just let the games play out on Saturday and we'll see.  Keep in mind I definitely feel Centre should be ranked ahead of Muhlenberg and can see an argument for being ranked ahead of TLU (but not completely sold on it) so don't kill me here for being anti-Centre.

I don't totally disagree, SaintsFAN. That's why I said "here's more crap". So no offense taken at all. It ABSOLUTELY says nothing with regards to UMHB relative to Centre. And two-off comparisons, where you don't even have a common opponent are sketchy at best. Unfortunately those top two games are the closest you can find to comparing TLU and Centre.

BTW, I live in Cinti and was really hoping to see a Thomas More vs Centre 1st round game. I'd love to see our teams play each year- it's really about time, as they're consistently good programs. Incidentally I played at Centre ('88), as did my older brother ('81). My nephew is a junior WR there now, along with my daughter, a sophomore. So I guess I take a "little" interest in my Colonels. ;-)

But I've always pulled for local teams, including The Mount, Georgetown, etc. We've ALWAYS either played or scrimmages Hanover. Great campus to visit and it's so close to Danville- less than 2 hours. But I think it would be great to drop them and pickup TMore and start a great intrastate rivalry.

What do you think?

PM sent -- didn't want to bog down this thread with my reply

[ExTartanPlayer]

I wondering with the continue growth of DIII football teams, what do you think will be the next stage regarding DIII playoffs. Do we keep it simple and have just conference champions (assuming we get to 32 AQ conferences)? Or, do extend a weekend and have play-in games? As we all know, the best 32 teams never make the playoff.

We do have play in games already.  11 weeks of them.

Bingo.

Bitching about teams getting left out of the playoffs is dumb in the current format; there are plenty of Pool A's to go around. With rare exceptions like an undefeated Pool B team, everyone has a path to the dance when the first ball of the season is kicked off. Win'em all.

Not everyone gets a damn trophy. Deal with it.

[smedindy]

And maybe send 2-4 (purple) teams up to D2 or 1AA

And to hell with the rest of their athletics program, or the mission and vision of the University and Athletics department?

[smedindy]

It will remain at 32 ... because it would take a change in the Division III rules to grow any bigger. Football is capped at 32. And honestly... where in the world are you going to find another week to fit in an extra week of playoffs? And growth in Division III is actually slowing a bit, which isn't a bad thing to be honest.

To be honest, the growth is the thing that I think needs to be capped. If we are locked in at 32 teams, we should lock in the number of schools in D3. Just a thought...

We can't. There are a boatload of schools that don't play football that are D3. If they decide to add football, like Hendrix and George Fox, we must, allow them in!

Growth for D3 helps us ALL! The playoffs will sort themselves out; the key is access and opportunity to intercollegiate athletics.

[Bombers798891]

We can't. There are a boatload of schools that don't play football that are D3. If they decide to add football, like Hendrix and George Fox, we must, allow them in!

Growth for D3 helps us ALL! The playoffs will sort themselves out; the key is access and opportunity to intercollegiate athletics.

Except, "The playoffs will sort themselves out" doesn't actually solve the problem we could be facing. Just because you don't want to address the issue doesn't mean it just goes away or gets fixed.

Look, if we are going to keep the playoffs at 32 teams because we don't want to add another week to the season, that means we can't have more than 32 conferences, because then we're not giving auto-access through the AQ, which is a tenet of Division III athletics.

How do we add a "boatload" of teams while keeping the conference total under 32? Eventually, something has to change. You either have to cut off opportunity, or add another week. There's no way around it

[FCGrizzliesGrad]

If you reduce the length of the regular season by 1 week (10 weeks rather than 11) and thus eliminate bye weeks for everyone, you'd have an extra week for playoffs without changing the start or end dates. How feasible that is I don't know, but it'd be the only option without starting the season earlier or ending later.

[wally_wabash]

Where are all of these extra conferences coming from?

It's not just adding a week to the season either (which the Division III president are never going to do)- who's paying for an entire extra round's worth of games?

[art76]

We can't. There are a boatload of schools that don't play football that are D3. If they decide to add football, like Hendrix and George Fox, we must, allow them in!

Growth for D3 helps us ALL! The playoffs will sort themselves out; the key is access and opportunity to intercollegiate athletics.

Except, "The playoffs will sort themselves out" doesn't actually solve the problem we could be facing. Just because you don't want to address the issue doesn't mean it just goes away or gets fixed.

Look, if we are going to keep the playoffs at 32 teams because we don't want to add another week to the season, that means we can't have more than 32 conferences, because then we're not giving auto-access through the AQ, which is a tenet of Division III athletics.

How do we add a "boatload" of teams while keeping the conference total under 32? Eventually, something has to change. You either have to cut off opportunity, or add another week. There's no way around it

32 AQs times 8 teams in a conference equals 256 teams
32 AQs times 9 teams in a conference equals 288 teams
32 AQs times 10 teams in a conference equals 320 teams

There are 244 teams this season minus the MESCAC that does not compete in the post season equals 234 teams right now.

So we have to wait at least until there are more than 22 new teams wanting to join D3 Football before we "start having problems" and as many as 86 more teams with a 32 field playoff schedule.

I think we have a few years to worry about it.

[smedindy]

We can't. There are a boatload of schools that don't play football that are D3. If they decide to add football, like Hendrix and George Fox, we must, allow them in!

Growth for D3 helps us ALL! The playoffs will sort themselves out; the key is access and opportunity to intercollegiate athletics.

Except, "The playoffs will sort themselves out" doesn't actually solve the problem we could be facing. Just because you don't want to address the issue doesn't mean it just goes away or gets fixed.

Look, if we are going to keep the playoffs at 32 teams because we don't want to add another week to the season, that means we can't have more than 32 conferences, because then we're not giving auto-access through the AQ, which is a tenet of Division III athletics.

How do we add a "boatload" of teams while keeping the conference total under 32? Eventually, something has to change. You either have to cut off opportunity, or add another week. There's no way around it

Most all of those teams can't or won't support football. Some may, but many won't.

The point was that if an Oglethorpe or Calvin decided to add football, they should be allowed to easily without people getting their shorts in a knot.