2015 D3 Season: NATIONAL PERSPECTIVE

Started by D3soccerwatcher, February 08, 2015, 12:49:03 AM

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jknezek

Quote from: Joe Wally on July 20, 2015, 10:31:17 PM
Thanks!

Just wondering how the United States takes its next steps in its evolution as a soccer nation.

Slowly. Development is driven by money. I have great faith in the MLS teams, but they need to actually make money. While the recent TV deal is a huge step forward, it's simply a drop in the bucket. These teams have great local followings, but the games need to turn into national events. I do think MLS will overtake the NHL, and I think eventually baseball is in trouble. Though that is probably at least a generation off. If MLS could start getting TV deals on par with what the NHL gets, and a similar national audience, the development academies would take huge leaps forward.

The other thing is the lower leagues need to change. Think of the soccer period in England. There are 20 teams in the premiership, 24 Championship teams, 24 League One, 24 League Two. So this relatively small country has 90+ professional teams where the players can actually make a year round living playing soccer. That is a huge amount of development per population. In the U.S. we have 20 or so (it seems in flux all the time) professional teams where players can make a year round living, that is MLS, and a bunch of NASL and USL teams where players can starve for the love of the game and work jobs in the off-season to survive.

That isn't going to cut it. I don't think the U.S. will ever support a soccer pyramid like England, but I do think that MLS, if it continues to grow, can support a farm system like MLB. Each team has two or three professional affiliates in lower levels, each with their own development academies. I think MLS will eventually end up with 34 teams in two divisions, based on other professional leagues and the inclusion of Canada. So if each MLS team had a pair of USL level affiliates that paid some kind of living wage, you would have almost 100 professional teams. Still low per population density, but probably good enough to make sure not too many players are slipping through the cracks. It would make sense to mandate that 80% of those lower level teams are made up of home country passport players. So MLS would be free to stock rosters with premier talent, but our development would be mostly home grown.

And no, I have no good idea of what to do with the NASL. Give it 20 or 30 years. Soccer has come a long way in the last 20, I think it will continue to move along at a good pace in the future. Short of football imploding due to tramatic brain injuries and the NBA rigging itself out of business, it's never going to be the top sport. But it doesn't have to be the top sport in the U.S. to allow the U.S. team and league to be among the best in the world.

Nutmeg

Quote from: jknezek on July 21, 2015, 09:36:15 AM
Quote from: Joe Wally on July 20, 2015, 10:31:17 PM
Thanks!

Just wondering how the United States takes its next steps in its evolution as a soccer nation.

Slowly. Development is driven by money. I have great faith in the MLS teams, but they need to actually make money. While the recent TV deal is a huge step forward, it's simply a drop in the bucket. These teams have great local followings, but the games need to turn into national events. I do think MLS will overtake the NHL, and I think eventually baseball is in trouble. Though that is probably at least a generation off. If MLS could start getting TV deals on par with what the NHL gets, and a similar national audience, the development academies would take huge leaps forward.

The other thing is the lower leagues need to change. Think of the soccer period in England. There are 20 teams in the premiership, 24 Championship teams, 24 League One, 24 League Two. So this relatively small country has 90+ professional teams where the players can actually make a year round living playing soccer. That is a huge amount of development per population. In the U.S. we have 20 or so (it seems in flux all the time) professional teams where players can make a year round living, that is MLS, and a bunch of NASL and USL teams where players can starve for the love of the game and work jobs in the off-season to survive.

That isn't going to cut it. I don't think the U.S. will ever support a soccer pyramid like England, but I do think that MLS, if it continues to grow, can support a farm system like MLB. Each team has two or three professional affiliates in lower levels, each with their own development academies. I think MLS will eventually end up with 34 teams in two divisions, based on other professional leagues and the inclusion of Canada. So if each MLS team had a pair of USL level affiliates that paid some kind of living wage, you would have almost 100 professional teams. Still low per population density, but probably good enough to make sure not too many players are slipping through the cracks. It would make sense to mandate that 80% of those lower level teams are made up of home country passport players. So MLS would be free to stock rosters with premier talent, but our development would be mostly home grown.

And no, I have no good idea of what to do with the NASL. Give it 20 or 30 years. Soccer has come a long way in the last 20, I think it will continue to move along at a good pace in the future. Short of football imploding due to tramatic brain injuries and the NBA rigging itself out of business, it's never going to be the top sport. But it doesn't have to be the top sport in the U.S. to allow the U.S. team and league to be among the best in the world.

Very well said!

Saint of Old

#227
Former Saint Striker Carruth might have signaled his intentions by bringing in  a very solid recruiting class to build on Heidelberg's '14 NCAA run.

http://athletics.heidelberg.edu/sports/msoc/2015-16/releases/20150708h2d2ma

Equally important he has hired a St. Lawrence All Time great, Andrew Bednarsky to be his assistant in taking the team forward.

Joe Wally

Thanks, JK

I would love to see the U.S. develop the "soccer pyramid" that we see in England, but as you say the money is not there.  An added problem is the fact that you have a large network of collegiate programs that siphon resources out of what would be that "soccer pyramid." 

jknezek

Quote from: Joe Wally on July 22, 2015, 12:58:55 PM
Thanks, JK

I would love to see the U.S. develop the "soccer pyramid" that we see in England, but as you say the money is not there.  An added problem is the fact that you have a large network of collegiate programs that siphon resources out of what would be that "soccer pyramid."

I think you'll see a continued marginalization of the college game for the truly elite youth as the MLS academies gain strength. We've seen it at the h.s. level, it is starting to creep up to the college level. There is a better way to learn soccer than to play at the college level. That goes for all sports, of course, and is a reason why I think MLB does the best job of ensuring the best players rise to the top and the NFL does the worst job. But all of that is neither here nor there.

The best kids will still get degrees if they want them, but they won't be playing college soccer. On the upside, that's still only skimming a couple hundred top prospects off, and the rules for college soccer ensure the level of play isn't very good anyway, so I doubt anyone will notice too much.

Corazon

Good point re the rules of college soccer. The substitution rules are misguided and ensure the emphasis on athleticism and ugly soccer over skill will continue.

jknezek

Quote from: Corazon on July 22, 2015, 04:24:31 PM
Good point re the rules of college soccer. The substitution rules are misguided and ensure the emphasis on athleticism and ugly soccer over skill will continue.

Not the only problem. The restrictions on practice time, which exist for all sports, is worse. It guarantees a minimum of team cohesiveness and pushes teams to play long ball with athletes instead of soccer. PDL with its short season and seemingly random team make up year to year does the same thing. This is one of several reasons I find college soccer and the PDL developmental dead ends.

Nutmeg

Quote from: jknezek on July 22, 2015, 04:29:31 PM
Quote from: Corazon on July 22, 2015, 04:24:31 PM
Good point re the rules of college soccer. The substitution rules are misguided and ensure the emphasis on athleticism and ugly soccer over skill will continue.

Not the only problem. The restrictions on practice time, which exist for all sports, is worse. It guarantees a minimum of team cohesiveness and pushes teams to play long ball with athletes instead of soccer. PDL with its short season and seemingly random team make up year to year does the same thing. This is one of several reasons I find college soccer and the PDL developmental dead ends.

Yes, college soccer is not for the top premier players due to developmental time constraints....it serves most players needs and provides for an education...it is not optimal for the cream of the crop...

deutschfan

Quote from: Saint of Old on July 22, 2015, 12:56:27 PM
Former Saint Striker Carruth might have signaled his intentions by bringing in  a very solid recruiting class to build on Heidelberg's '14 NCAA run.

http://athletics.heidelberg.edu/sports/msoc/2015-16/releases/20150708h2d2ma

Equally important he has hired a St. Lawrence All Time great, Andrew Bednarsky to be his assistant in taking the team forward.

Heidelberg's gain is St. Lawrence's loss.  As a youth coach in Southern California Carruth convinced a good number of high quality players to leave the warm climes of San Diego and play near the Canadian border.  It looks like those same kids now will be heading to Northern Ohio and the home of Fort Ball. 



PaulNewman

Quote from: 4231CenterBack on July 29, 2015, 06:00:55 PM
Not quite Louisville.....

http://pbasailfish.com/profile.asp?playerID=1239

Geez, maybe should have stayed at Messiah and makes one wonder why he left Messiah.

I can honestly say, and with no negativity intended, that 5 minutes ago is the very first time I have ever heard of Palm Beach Atlantic University.


Nutmeg

Quote from: NCAC New England on July 29, 2015, 06:20:31 PM
Quote from: 4231CenterBack on July 29, 2015, 06:00:55 PM
Not quite Louisville.....

http://pbasailfish.com/profile.asp?playerID=1239

Geez, maybe should have stayed at Messiah and makes one wonder why he left Messiah.

I can honestly say, and with no negativity intended, that 5 minutes ago is the very first time I have ever heard of Palm Beach Atlantic University.

If u looked at all of the D1 soccer teams, there are several you or I probably never heard of.....I wonder what the quality of soccer is like at those relatively unknown institutions....

PaulNewman

Quote from: Nutmeg on July 29, 2015, 10:07:21 PM
Quote from: NCAC New England on July 29, 2015, 06:20:31 PM
Quote from: 4231CenterBack on July 29, 2015, 06:00:55 PM
Not quite Louisville.....

http://pbasailfish.com/profile.asp?playerID=1239

Geez, maybe should have stayed at Messiah and makes one wonder why he left Messiah.

I can honestly say, and with no negativity intended, that 5 minutes ago is the very first time I have ever heard of Palm Beach Atlantic University.

If u looked at all of the D1 soccer teams, there are several you or I probably never heard of.....I wonder what the quality of soccer is like at those relatively unknown institutions....

I don't think there is a D1 I've never heard of.  This school is D2.