2015 D3 Season: NATIONAL PERSPECTIVE

[Golden_Fan]

NSCAA NCAA Division III Men - National - Poll 2 - September 22, 2015

1 Tufts University 
2 Kenyon College 
3 Franklin & Marshall College
4 Christopher Newport University
5 University of Wisconsin-Whitewater 
6 Calvin College
7 Amherst College
8 Whitworth University
9 Denison University
10 Loras College
11 University Of Chicago 
12 Montclair State University 
13 Carnegie Mellon University
14 Eastern University
15 Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute 
16 Brandeis University
17 University of Texas-Dallas
18 Washington University (Mo.)
19 St. Lawrence University
20 Saint John's University
21 Occidental College
22 Salisbury University 
23 Drew University 
24 Eastern Connecticut State University
25 Thomas More College


Also receiving votes: Stockton University (13), Plattsburgh State University (12), Trinity University (Texas) (12), Colorado College (12), Rowan University (10), North Park University (9), Gettysburg College (3), Messiah College (3)

http://www.nscaa.com/rankings/4402

Darn you beat me to it by a minute

[lastguyoffthebench]

Surprised to see Amherst in the top 8 given the formula of slotting the teams geographically.  Even so, it is well deserved.

3 NJAC and UAA teams in the rankings
2 NESCAC, CAC, NCAC, Centennial, Liberty League

[Mr.Right]

Did I see that Loras lost 5-2 tonight?!?!
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Yep, to a D1 team.
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Got ya I didn't know they were D1. Thanks for the info! How does that factor into their SOS by playing a D1 team?
[/quote]






I believe a D3 benefits none and a LEGIT D1 team would be heavily penalized for a tie or loss if they were in contention for an NCAA at-large, which this team is clearly not. If both teams are playing this like an exhibition why not schedule this in the spring. If Loras is resting players I see no point in risking injury. This D1 and D3 thing used to happen a lot in the 80's and 90's but D1's got scared off because they gained nothing from it. It still does occasionally happen when you have friends that are coaching or this or that but it is rare

[Mr.Right]

Why is Calvin #6?  Please tell me who they have played and the results? A 1-0 win over a "heavily inflated team in Gordon and a 0-0 tie at Endicott and a 11-0 bashing of a team that most likely could not stand on 2 legs

[Flying Weasel]

Surprised to see Amherst in the top 8 given the formula of slotting the teams geographically.  Even so, it is well deserved.

Well, the NSCAA has relaxed their formulaic regional-equality construction of their national ranking over the past few years, allowing themselves an exception or two in any given week.  Baby steps!

[Mr.Right]

Why is Calvin #6?  Please tell me who they have played and the results? A 1-0 win over a "heavily inflated team in Gordon and a 0-0 tie at Endicott and a 11-0 bashing of a team that most likely could not stand on 2 legs

#21 IN D3 POLL IS WAY TO HIGH.....If we are not including SOS than why not include Middlebury's heavily inflated record

[Mr.Right]

hmm...Stevens really did draw Elmira...excellent result for Elmira who used to be a constant force in Western NY for years until their sudden irrelevancy the past 10-15 years, kind of like Ithaca but not as loud a thud.

[PaulNewman]

RE: latest rankings

Hopefully the Tufts faithful can breathe a little easier

Just a few quibbles...

In the D3 soccer poll, not sure how CMU could be #5 even before last night's draw.  I'm a big Brandeis fan but the Judges seem a little high, as they've won a bunch of 1-0 games, at least a couple of them in OT.  ECSU I think is too high and more correctly ranked #24 by NSCAA.  I'd have Whitworth a little higher.  Salisbury seems high at #12.  Plattsburgh and Denison just about right.  I'd have Calvin higher than #21 even though I agree their schedule has been soft (and btw, what has happened to Hope??).  DePauw at #22 is fair but they could be a little higher.  I would have Thomas More ranked but can't complain since they are 1st in the RV category.  Biggest omissions on D3 poll would seem to be Eastern, Drew, Case Western, and UMass-Boston.

In the NSCAA poll, #9 seems high for Denison.  Odd to have Loras still at #10 but then not have unbeaten DePauw ranked at all.  RPI at #15 seems low.  Not sure about Eastern at #14 as I know almost nothing about Eastern or Drew.  Biggest omissions on NSCAA seem to be Plattsburgh, DePauw, Case Western, UMass-Boston, and I guess Drew.

And maybe Hobart should be getting more love.

[blooter442]

Not sure how Chicago is only one spot behind Loras. I know Loras has had a couple of slips in the past few days, and so obviously they weren't going to be top six anymore, but they absolutely FLATTENED Chicago 4-0 AWAY. The Maroons probably deserve to be in the top 20, but 11 seems very high.

[PaulNewman]

Mr.Right, prediction on ECSU @Gordon today?

[Mr.Right]

Mr.Right, prediction on ECSU @Gordon today?

Last year ECSU stuck the 2nd to final DAGGER in Gordon's backs with a 1-0 win. Then inexplicably Nicholls comes from 2-0 behind to defeat Gordon in the CCC playoffs. This game is much more important for Gordon because they are not going to beat Tufts and if they do not win their league no one else in the CCC will be regionally ranked. I say the game ends 1-0 in either direction

[Flying Weasel]

In the D3 soccer poll, not sure how CMU could be #5 even before last night's draw.  I'm a big Brandeis fan but the Judges seem a little high, as they've won a bunch of 1-0 games, at least a couple of them in OT.  ECSU I think is too high and more correctly ranked #24 by NSCAA.  I'd have Whitworth a little higher.  Salisbury seems high at #12.  Plattsburgh and Denison just about right.  I'd have Calvin higher than #21 even though I agree their schedule has been soft (and btw, what has happened to Hope??).  DePauw at #22 is fair but they could be a little higher.  I would have Thomas More ranked but can't complain since they are 1st in the RV category.  Biggest omissions on D3 poll would seem to be Eastern, Drew, Case Western, and UMass-Boston.

But, of course, for every team you think is too high, you need to come up with someone who deserves to slide up in their place.  I think it's been really tough (tougher than normal) for voters to get a handle on things with so many top teams picking up two or three blemishes, and some of them really ugly blemishes.  Thing is, there's more teams that should slide down the rankings and maybe out of the rankings altogether than there are teams that you can be convinced are Top 25 quality, much less Top 15, Top 10 quality.  In short, there's not twenty-five "Top 25" teams at the moment, nor are there ten "Top 10" teams.  At least that's how it feels to me.

[Mid-Atlantic Fan]

RE: latest rankings

Hopefully the Tufts faithful can breathe a little easier

Just a few quibbles...

In the D3 soccer poll, not sure how CMU could be #5 even before last night's draw.  I'm a big Brandeis fan but the Judges seem a little high, as they've won a bunch of 1-0 games, at least a couple of them in OT.  ECSU I think is too high and more correctly ranked #24 by NSCAA.  I'd have Whitworth a little higher.  Salisbury seems high at #12.  Plattsburgh and Denison just about right.  I'd have Calvin higher than #21 even though I agree their schedule has been soft (and btw, what has happened to Hope??).  DePauw at #22 is fair but they could be a little higher.  I would have Thomas More ranked but can't complain since they are 1st in the RV category.  Biggest omissions on D3 poll would seem to be Eastern, Drew, Case Western, and UMass-Boston.

In the NSCAA poll, #9 seems high for Denison.  Odd to have Loras still at #10 but then not have unbeaten DePauw ranked at all.  RPI at #15 seems low.  Not sure about Eastern at #14 as I know almost nothing about Eastern or Drew.  Biggest omissions on NSCAA seem to be Plattsburgh, DePauw, Case Western, UMass-Boston, and I guess Drew.

And maybe Hobart should be getting more love.

Very high rankings for Eastern and Drew. Also surprised by that. I thought Eastern might barely crack the top 25 if anything but jumping to 14 was a shock. The only tough team they have played thus far was their first game at Lycoming which they escaped in OT 1-0. Other than that their wins are average. Swarthmore I guess is an okay win? But by the looks of their schedule they are just sneaking by teams at the moment. If you look at the other side of the ball...they could run the table because of how poor their conference is. Maybe the committee was anticipating that? Hard to tell and I doubt if the committee looks that far in to it.

Lastly, it could have something to do with the coach. Mark Wagner's brother, Dan, is the head of the Middle Atlantic Region committee for NSCAA. F&M and Eastern #1 and #2 in that region...Eastern "all of a sudden" catapults into the top 15 out of no where? I think that Dan is giving his brother Mark an early Christmas present.

[PaulNewman]

FW, understood.  But just to take the example of CMU, here are 5 teams just off the top of my head that should be slotted ahead of CMU.....Amherst, UW-W, RPI, Whitworth, and probably Plattsburgh.  And while the top 25 and top 10 may in fact be soft, I wonder if partly that is the impression because of seeing names we aren't used to seeing there.  One might rhetorically ask, "Is the top 10 only legit if the usual suspects are in there?"

[Mr.Right]

RE: latest rankings

Hopefully the Tufts faithful can breathe a little easier

Just a few quibbles...

In the D3 soccer poll, not sure how CMU could be #5 even before last night's draw.  I'm a big Brandeis fan but the Judges seem a little high, as they've won a bunch of 1-0 games, at least a couple of them in OT.  ECSU I think is too high and more correctly ranked #24 by NSCAA.  I'd have Whitworth a little higher.  Salisbury seems high at #12.  Plattsburgh and Denison just about right.  I'd have Calvin higher than #21 even though I agree their schedule has been soft (and btw, what has happened to Hope??).  DePauw at #22 is fair but they could be a little higher.  I would have Thomas More ranked but can't complain since they are 1st in the RV category.  Biggest omissions on D3 poll would seem to be Eastern, Drew, Case Western, and UMass-Boston.

In the NSCAA poll, #9 seems high for Denison.  Odd to have Loras still at #10 but then not have unbeaten DePauw ranked at all.  RPI at #15 seems low.  Not sure about Eastern at #14 as I know almost nothing about Eastern or Drew.  Biggest omissions on NSCAA seem to be Plattsburgh, DePauw, Case Western, UMass-Boston, and I guess Drew.

And maybe Hobart should be getting more love.

Very high rankings for Eastern and Drew. Also surprised by that. I thought Eastern might barely crack the top 25 if anything but jumping to 14 was a shock. The only tough team they have played thus far was their first game at Lycoming which they escaped in OT 1-0. Other than that their wins are average. Swarthmore I guess is an okay win? But by the looks of their schedule they are just sneaking by teams at the moment. If you look at the other side of the ball...they could run the table because of how poor their conference is. Maybe the committee was anticipating that? Hard to tell and I doubt if the committee looks that far in to it.

Lastly, it could have something to do with the coach. Mark Wagner's brother, Dan, is the head of the Middle Atlantic Region committee for NSCAA. F&M and Eastern #1 and #2 in that region...Eastern "all of a sudden" catapults into the top 15 out of no where? I think that Dan is giving his brother Mark an early Christmas present.

This would not be the 1st time something like this has gone on. I am not saying this info is true that you have stated but Chris Apple up at U of Rochester used to be on the NCAA regional committee and about 7-8 years ago you would see a 8-5-3 Rochester team making the NCAA's over other deserving teams. THIS IS NOT FACT JUST RUMOR. Obviously, Coaches are out of the room when their team is being discussed but what I believe happens with the regional committee's are sometimes some individuals have their own agenda's and MAYBE sometimes you scratch my back I scratch urs goes on with not just getting teams in BUT WHO IS HOSTING.