2016 NCAA Tournament

[John Gleich]

St. Thomas was great tonight, but the Tommies have been great all throughout this tournament thus far.

The NESCAC guys will be peeved at me for saying this, but I think it's going to come down to St. Thomas versus Benedictine (although I've been impressed by what I've seen from Christopher Newport).

I didn't think CNU had played very well in this tournament until tonight.  They finally looked like they did during the peak parts of the regular season.  That will really be a great game on Friday.  Glad I get to be there to see it.

That might be a testament to them as a team. They find a way to win even when things aren't going right.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Nice touch from the NCAA... they have a sectional trophy now for the winning team... meaning there is now a trophy for the case of final four teams even if they don't win the semifinals.

[Greek Tragedy]

Nice touch from the NCAA... they have a sectional trophy now for the winning team... meaning there is now a trophy for the case of final four teams even if they don't win the semifinals.

That's really cool. I like that idea.

Should be some great games on Friday. The "New boys", Benedictine, vs the "Old pros" who've been there before, Amherst. And also we'll have a very solid team in St. Thomas taking on the 3-headed monster (Carter, McFarland and Daly) in Christopher Newport.

I think I'm taking Benedictine vs St. Thomas in the Final.

[fantastic50]

Nice touch from the NCAA... they have a sectional trophy now for the winning team... meaning there is now a trophy for the case of final four teams even if they don't win the semifinals.

I believe that there were already trophies for semifinalists, and the issue was that three teams in Salem were receiving trophies following a season-ending loss. For the price of a 5th trophy, the NCAA could make sure that all trophies were awarded to teams that were excited to receive them.

[ronk]

Nice touch from the NCAA... they have a sectional trophy now for the winning team... meaning there is now a trophy for the case of final four teams even if they don't win the semifinals.

I believe that there were already trophies for semifinalists, and the issue was that three teams in Salem were receiving trophies following a season-ending loss. For the price of a 5th trophy, the NCAA could make sure that all trophies were awarded to teams that were excited to receive them.

Sounds like a reasoned idea for the change.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Nice touch from the NCAA... they have a sectional trophy now for the winning team... meaning there is now a trophy for the case of final four teams even if they don't win the semifinals.

I believe that there were already trophies for semifinalists, and the issue was that three teams in Salem were receiving trophies following a season-ending loss. For the price of a 5th trophy, the NCAA could make sure that all trophies were awarded to teams that were excited to receive them.

I can't remember if they all got trophies. They did away with trophy presentations except after the championship (because they used to get them after the consolation game)... so I am not sure if they kept up the practice of giving them out to the two losing teams in the semis. I personally like this option better because it gives them something to "celebrate." It is actually six total trophies now as the runner up still gets a trophy in Salem.

[fantastic50]

Based on something I read a while back, about committee discussion leading up to this change, it was noted as going from 4 trophies to 5. This leads me to believe that they were awarding trophies to semifinalists (perhaps privately, rather than in a post-game ceremony) and that there is were no longer be a runner-up trophy, which is the only part that I found disappointing.  However, maybe that was subsequently changed to still include a runner-up trophy.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Well unless they change it this year, they always hand out a runner-up trophy to the best of my memory now at 15 straight (soon to to be 16) championship games (men's basketball, that is; plenty more counting other sports). The runner-up trophy is still something to put in the trophy case. I would be kind of surprised if they got rid of that... but who knows. I'll check out it.

[fantastic50]

It's a change for this year, and I confirmed the details at the link below, but yes, only a championship trophy will be presented in Salem.  From what I understand, it was hard enough to get the NCAA to approve the $500 for a 5th trophy (four sectional champs plus national champ, as compared to champ, runner-up, & two semifinalists previously), much less to get a 6th (to keep the national runner-up trophy.)  A 5th-trophy proposal was denied the previous year for budget-related reasons.

https://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/DIII%20MBB%20Comm%20Mtg%20Agenda-Supplements%202015.pdf

Championship Presentations, Trophies and Individual Awards. The committee determined that participant medallions should be mailed to all participating teams the first week of the tournament instead of sending them to the host institution for distribution. The committee approved changing the semifinalist trophies to sectional trophies and presenting them at an awards presentation at each of the four sectional sites. In Salem, the awards presentation would consist of the championship trophy only.

[pg04]

I'm glad D3 has the selection process it does after watching the D1 selection show. Seems much more transparent.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Thanks. Great update. People need to remember that wasn't a simple $500 decision. That was more like a $16,000 decision based on at least 32 trophies needed for runner-ups.

I'm glad D3 has the selection process it does after watching the D1 selection show. Seems much more transparent.

Considering how much information isn't revealed... that is a rather interesting point of view. The women certainly aren't that transparent.

[pg04]

Yeah I was comparing men vs. men selections. I know it isn't perfect and I know the seeds don't officially get revealed and so on but I feel like we can do something like KS does and get a pretty good feel on the numbers that the committee is using. It's hard to get a handle on what is important to the D1 committee.

Just my outsider's perspective though, I don't work nearly as closely as you do with it.

[fantastic50]

Thanks. Great update. People need to remember that wasn't a simple $500 decision. That was more like a $16,000 decision based on at least 32 trophies needed for runner-ups.

Where is the 32 coming from?  This decision involved D3 men's basketball only.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Yeah I was comparing men vs. men selections. I know it isn't perfect and I know the seeds don't officially get revealed and so on but I feel like we can do something like KS does and get a pretty good feel on the numbers that the committee is using. It's hard to get a handle on what is important to the D1 committee.

Just my outsider's perspective though, I don't work nearly as closely as you do with it.

Yeah, I hear ya there. At least we get an idea of what is going on.

Thanks. Great update. People need to remember that wasn't a simple $500 decision. That was more like a $16,000 decision based on at least 32 trophies needed for runner-ups.

Where is the 32 coming from?  This decision involved D3 men's basketball only.

I am making a bit of an assumption here, but usually decisions like these are not made for just one sport. They are made across the division for all sports because they want to make sure they are being fair to all championships. I will check to see if that is the case. Which handbook did you read it out of?

[fantastic50]

Thanks. Great update. People need to remember that wasn't a simple $500 decision. That was more like a $16,000 decision based on at least 32 trophies needed for runner-ups.

Where is the 32 coming from?  This decision involved D3 men's basketball only.

I am making a bit of an assumption here, but usually decisions like these are not made for just one sport. They are made across the division for all sports because they want to make sure they are being fair to all championships. I will check to see if that is the case. Which handbook did you read it out of?

Google searches of ncaa.org turned up the info in committee minutes (D3 MBKB committee, D3 championships committee, etc.)  From what I can tell, in order to get approval, the committee was required not only to make the change cost-neutral (by reducing the number of on-court logos) but also to ensure that the overall tournament awards costs would not exceed the budget, as had been an issue in recent past years.  Some aspects are mentioned in the D3 MBKB host operations manual.  However, because all of these are just snapshots of the process, I suspect that you may understand better the process & rationale by week's end.

https://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/MC_CC_October_16_Teleconference.pdf

https://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/DIII%20MBB%20Comm%20Mtg%20Agenda-Supplements%202015.pdf

https://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/2015-16_DIIIMBB_HostOps_20160120.pdf