The Big Dance

[PaulNewman]

Geez....sorry...Tufts is the new Harvard....good enough?

Well, let's not go overboard      Appreciate your analysis.

Also agree that it would be easy to turn down Lehigh for Tufts. The article says Rabines had strong interest from the Ivies and other d3 schools as well.

Looking for a thumbs up or fist bump emoji.....good luck to your son.

[Falconer]

Brother, I promise you I've watched the 2014 game many times over in addition to being there.  It is crazy to think the domino effect of that game. A loss that day and I don't think Tufts wins saturday. The current Juniors and Sophomores were recruited with the promise of championships. Tufts managed to win the first two championships on the back of a couple graduation classes that bought into Shapiros vision, but the classes that had already seen the promised land are on a whole different level. No disrespect to that 2014 team which I will remember for my whole life, but we have nothing on the current and future Jumbo editions.

David Brandt had exactly this attitude after beating Rowan for the first Falcon title in 2000. He wanted a championship so badly, had almost gone into OT in the Elite Eight in 1999 vs eventual champion SLU, and then found his team down 2-0 at halftime in the 2000 Semifinal vs unbeaten Linfield College. Brandt was not confident his team could come back in win that game. One of the greatest players (IMO) the Falcons ever faced, Chris McDonald (https://golinfieldwildcats.com/hof.aspx?hof=152), had scored twice; the details are now murky in my mind, but I think at least one of his goals was a brilliant free kick from far out. The Falcons had no answer for him.

During the halftime team meeting, however, one of the classiest things I can recall in D3 took place. Skip Roderick, the coach of Messiah's (then) arch-rival Etown (where he still coaches and now has more than 500 wins for the school that ranks second in victories in D3 history), approached Brandt and offered to talk to the players. His team had won it all in 1989, so Skip knew what it takes. He encouraged the Falcon players to come out hard in the second half--and, they did. A major adjustment was to give a bigger role to a very fast FR defender, Brown Vincent. But the biggest change was that Hayden Woodworth simply took over the game from his CM position. He scored himself and set up others. For the first time all season, an opponent consistently got behind the Linfield defenders, and the Falcons came away with a 3-2 win. The 2-0 Final vs Rowan was, IMO, downhill from there. Brandt saw Woodworth and that game as the defining moment in Falcon history. I think he was right. Hat's off to Skip for a huge assist.

[NEsoccerfan]

In a few instances, high D1 level players visit campus--about 20 years ago there was a local player (son of Messiah alumni) who briefly considered Messiah but ended up as an all-conference player at Penn State. He now coaches at D2 or NAIA level.

To have a little fun with my electronic friends from New England: the man I refer to here somewhat cryptically was a two-time AA who played several years for the New England Revolution and later briefly coached a Boston-area D3 team. As I understand it, few thought he'd actually end up at Messiah, but he did express some interest in doing so and did (I think) visit campus with that in mind as a possibility. (I happen to know his father, who taught HS math very successfully just a few miles from Messiah.)

Can anyone fill in the blank? 

Derek Potteiger?

Exactly. Well done. +K for playing the game.

Thanks. What's curious to me is him leaving Gordon (after taking them to the 2nd round of the NCAA tournament twice in his 4 years) for a D2 program.

Candidly, I don't know much about D2 as far as coaching prestige or pay, but I was always under the impression that D3 competition is stronger. Am I wrong about that? Outside of special circumstances - of which I admit there may be many - can anyone speculate why a coach would jump from a relatively successful d3 position to a D2 position?

[d4_Pace]

Mr. Right other my position you basically nailed. I think it was an injury or some sort of stoppage so we all watched towards the benches to grab water and I'm standing about 10 feet from coach serpone and he goes "Hey how have you been? Good to see you. You're playing real well today and having a good season so far"  And to be honest that might be the most rattled I've been after someone saying something to me. I mean you've been screaming your head off, guys are wrestling each other in the penalty box and here we are making small talk. It was pretty bizarre. Happened along those lines all four years but I was prepared for it the rest of the times.

[d4_Pace]

Paul Newman you're right Tufts is as good of as school as it was 10 years ago and the running joke on campus is still that its a bunch of Brown rejects, but I think you're a little off on the engineering factor. While the school itself is more known for the majors you mentioned if a guy wants to play d3 soccer and be an engineer there aren't that many places to look. Can't go to another NESCAC so right away thats a distinguishing factor from the other conferences, you go can go to MIT but the coach there described his situation as trying to find nobel prize winners that could also play sports, so thats a rare mix.  So I think the engineering factor is a big selling point to a bunch of guys and there are generally about 6-7 on the team any year.

[d4_Pace]

I think most schools let their guys have social media i don't really know. I mean with us if you're smart enough to get into tufts coach trusts that you're smart enough to handle your business. And if you mess up another guy on the team will step in and tell you to take down the post without coach having to get involved. 

In terms of playing time thats a culture thing, obviously guys are disappointed to not be playing more its natural. Every one of the guys was a high school or club star and now they might be the last guy on the bench. But there are so many success stories of that guy becoming a starter, captain, or even all-american that everyone puts their head down and fights to get better. And when the guy playing over you is one of your best friends there is no animosity. You are rooting for him to have the game of his life every time he steps out there even if that relegates you to a spectating role. And all the guys now know, any of the personal hardships of not playing are worth it cause every single guy gets one of those rings.

[PaulNewman]

Paul Newman you're right Tufts is as good of as school as it was 10 years ago and the running joke on campus is still that its a bunch of Brown rejects, but I think you're a little off on the engineering factor. While the school itself is more known for the majors you mentioned if a guy wants to play d3 soccer and be an engineer there aren't that many places to look. Can't go to another NESCAC so right away thats a distinguishing factor from the other conferences, you go can go to MIT but the coach there described his situation as trying to find nobel prize winners that could also play sports, so thats a rare mix.  So I think the engineering factor is a big selling point to a bunch of guys and there are generally about 6-7 on the team any year.

RPI, Rochester, most UAAs in general...Swat?  Doesn't Trinity have engineering?  WPI...Union....

I at least don't think of Tufts as an engineering mecca and I've lived 50 miles away from the campus for 25+ years (not that that means anything).  I also think it's possible that Tufts is a bigger deal outside of Massachusetts than it is for folks who have lived in Mass for years.

And you mean none of you guys can nab a Nobel Prize while you're accumulating national titles?   

[Gregory Sager]

Paul Newman you're right Tufts is as good of as school as it was 10 years ago and the running joke on campus is still that its a bunch of Brown rejects, but I think you're a little off on the engineering factor. While the school itself is more known for the majors you mentioned if a guy wants to play d3 soccer and be an engineer there aren't that many places to look. Can't go to another NESCAC so right away thats a distinguishing factor from the other conferences, you go can go to MIT but the coach there described his situation as trying to find nobel prize winners that could also play sports, so thats a rare mix.

If the MIT coach actually said that, then he's making excuses for himself. The MIT men's basketball team has won 20 games in nine of the last ten seasons, reaching the Elite Eight last season and the Final Four seven seasons ago.

[Dubuquer]

Paul Newman you're right Tufts is as good of as school as it was 10 years ago and the running joke on campus is still that its a bunch of Brown rejects, but I think you're a little off on the engineering factor. While the school itself is more known for the majors you mentioned if a guy wants to play d3 soccer and be an engineer there aren't that many places to look. Can't go to another NESCAC so right away thats a distinguishing factor from the other conferences, you go can go to MIT but the coach there described his situation as trying to find nobel prize winners that could also play sports, so thats a rare mix.  So I think the engineering factor is a big selling point to a bunch of guys and there are generally about 6-7 on the team any year.

RPI, Rochester, most UAAs in general...Swat?  Doesn't Trinity have engineering?  WPI...Union....

I at least don't think of Tufts as an engineering mecca and I've lived 50 miles away from the campus for 25+ years (not that that means anything).  I also think it's possible that Tufts is a bigger deal outside of Massachusetts than it is for folks who have lived in Mass for years.

And you mean none of you guys can nab a Nobel Prize while you're accumulating national titles?   

UW-Platteville has a huge engineering program.  I think between 1/3 and 1/2 of the 8000 students there are majoring in engineering of some sort.  Loras is also the only small college in Iowa with an ABET-accredited engineering program, but it's a tiny, tiny program.

[Ejay]

Carnegie Mellon and Johns Hopkins both have excellent engineering programs. In fact, I believe JHU has the #1 ranked biomedical engineering program in country.

[Buck O.]

Mr. Right, he just misses the point. You are an equal opportunity critic, which is what I like about you.

Haha thanks my man...I really focused hard this season on watching Brandeis as much as possible. I am glad I did because between yourself and Bloots and a couple others we all really dug deep on them this season. You can be brutally honest yourself in regards to Deis but very fair which is really all you can ask for on here. Which gets me thinking to myself about 2019 and maybe focusing more of my time on UAA schools. I mean I always caught 5-6 Brandeis games a year but this season I am betting I saw about 10 but I only would see the other UAA schools maybe 2-3 games each if that. Last season I watched Chicago a ton but yea maybe a deeper dive into the UAA is calling.

I hope you do that.  I'd be interested to see what you think.  A week or two ago, you mentioned how you preferred the play in the UAA to the play in the NESCAC, which you think is excessively conservative.  I was going to ask why, given that opinion, you don't watch more UAA games.  I never got around to it, but you anticipated my question without my having to ask it. 

[Buck O.]

Paul Newman you're right Tufts is as good of as school as it was 10 years ago and the running joke on campus is still that its a bunch of Brown rejects, but I think you're a little off on the engineering factor. While the school itself is more known for the majors you mentioned if a guy wants to play d3 soccer and be an engineer there aren't that many places to look. Can't go to another NESCAC so right away thats a distinguishing factor from the other conferences, you go can go to MIT but the coach there described his situation as trying to find nobel prize winners that could also play sports, so thats a rare mix.

If the MIT coach actually said that, then he's making excuses for himself. The MIT men's basketball team has won 20 games in nine of the last ten seasons, reaching the Elite Eight last season and the Final Four seven seasons ago.

More generally, MIT finished second in the Learfield Directors' Cup standings last year, so it's not just hoops.

https://nacda.com/news/2018/5/31/Williams_Captures_Division_III_Learfield_Directors_amp_8217_Cup_Title.aspx

[Falconer]

Calvin and Messiah both have large (for undergraduate colleges) engineering programs. POY Geoff Pezon (https://www.linkedin.com/in/geoffrey-pezon-a7188834/), regional AA defender Chris Claassen, and many other Falcons have been engineering majors. Most colleges similar to Calvin and Messiah do not have 4-year, on-site engineering programs; in this respect they are like most of the NESCAC schools. For example, Wheaton has a 5-year program, with 3 years at Wheaton and 2 more at almost any other school that offers engineering. In most cases, that makes it impossible to play soccer all 4 years--a big advantage for Calvin and Messiah that is often overlooked when comparing the soccer programs at similar schools. However, according to the Wheaton website, "Students completing their engineering coursework near Wheaton (IIT, Northern Illinois University, or University of Illinois at Chicago) may remain in Wheaton College housing and may continue to participate fully in extra-curricular activities at the College, including athletics." Obviously that still involves 5 years of expenses, not 4, and the choice of engineering programs is very limited. So, the advantage for Calvin and Wheaton remains.

As far as I know, the only majors that probably preclude playing soccer at a place like Messiah or Calvin would be related to music. Such programs typically require students to be heavily involved in a variety of ensembles, mostly or entirely rehearsing in the late afternoon or evening. One of the few Messiah players I know well personally (an AA from the last decade) told me that he considered playing soccer at another college where he'd been admitted to its music conservatory, with the understanding that he could indeed play soccer there and major in music. However, Brandt told him frankly that he couldn't do both soccer and music at Messiah. Regardless of whether what the other school told him was realistic, he ended up doing a business major at Messiah with some music courses and lessons mixed in.

Do others have any information about mixing soccer with a music major?

[Ommadawn]

*My biggest regret in attending the games in person is that I did not get to view and, more importantly, hear Ira and Dave's webcast.  A family member who tuned in gave high marks to the commentary.

Rejoice Ommadawn, that's an easy regret to fix! - https://www.ncaa.com/video/soccer-men/2018-12-01/diii-mens-soccer-2018-championship-recap

Much appreciated!

[Ommadawn]

I think it's relatively rare for any NESCAC students, let along NESCAC student athletes, to take a full year abroad.  Many of the soccer players typically spend spring semester of their junior year abroad.  As I've mentioned before, my younger son (who played for Bowdoin) "studied" (I use that term loosely) abroad in Rome during his spring semester.  He became fast friends with a Williams soccer player who was in the same program, and they trained occasionally with a low level club team.  His Williams colleague became a close enough friend that he attended my son's wedding earlier this year.  Pretty cool...

Definitely cool!  Some study abroad programs are more soccer-friendly than others and develop reputations along those lines, attracting players from multiple institutions.  Opportunities for intrauniversity and club play vary.