Big Dance

[d4_Pace]

a great performance by Tufts to return to back-back final fours for the first time.  Zach lane bagged two goals today after missing a few chances yesterday. He always plays his best soccer at the end of year with the a goal in the final four and the game winner in the title game last year. Ian Daly with two goals in two games from right back. Not a bad performance for a sophomore. 

Round 3 against Calvin will be a battle. Another game where the first goal will be so crucial. Neither team will want to have to play from behind.

[Mr.Right]

https://mobile.twitter.com/CentreAthletics/status/1198709772121497600?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1198709772121497600&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcentrecolonels.com%2Fnews%2F2019%2F11%2F24%2Fmens-soccer-barth-newton-extend-magical-season-with-late-goals-send-colonels-to-final-four.aspx

The joy of a first ever trip to the Final Four...

Congrats to Centre...However, that is flat out the worst defending I have ever seen in an Elite 8

[Mr.Right]

a great performance by Tufts to return to back-back final fours for the first time.  Zach lane bagged two goals today after missing a few chances yesterday. He always plays his best soccer at the end of year with the a goal in the final four and the game winner in the title game last year. Ian Daly with two goals in two games from right back. Not a bad performance for a sophomore. 

Round 3 against Calvin will be a battle. Another game where the first goal will be so crucial. Neither team will want to have to play from behind.

Becoming a national rivalry with expected entertainment

[oldonionbag]

A great year for the NESCAC with three teams in the elite eight (and Conn only eliminated by a conference foe). Could we have an all-NESCAC final? The Calvin Tufts game should be phenomenal. Don't know too much about Centre though...any idea how they play/what to watch for?

[Falconer]

A great year for the NESCAC with three teams in the elite eight (and Conn only eliminated by a conference foe). Could we have an all-NESCAC final? The Calvin Tufts game should be phenomenal. Don't know too much about Centre though...any idea how they play/what to watch for?

I watched a lot of their game with MSU, in which Centre dominated the stats but was trailing 2-1 late in regulation. I can only go with the eye test on a very limited range of data--it's the only time I've seen either team play this year. IMO, they aren't as good at either end of the field as Messiah or Hopkins or F&M, to name 3 teams I know pretty well, but it goes without saying that you don't get to the Final Four by fooling people with mirrors--they beat 3 darn good teams and a decent team in K'zoo, so they are no fluke. I agree they are the weakest link in the Final Four, but they are still in that group this year. Now watch them win it all, which I would thoroughly enjoy. Please make me eat these words. :-)

The big target (Alexander Garuba) is a legitimate threat, even though he had just one assist yesterday. He got the bulk of the defensive attention. I am prepared to believe that his 23 goals scored this year would have been similar against a tougher schedule. He has some help up front, too--if you give him too much attention, someone else will be open and make you pay. Defensively they can be beaten, and I expect someone like Amherst or Tufts to take advantage of them, perhaps early in the game.

Sorry not to have deeper analysis to offer.

[PaulNewman]

Centre is the clear and obvious Cinderella, but they've done basically everything they could do....earning and then maintaining a solid regional ranking, winning their AQ, dispatching well-regarded John Carroll at John Carroll, beating CMS, and getting by Montclair.  The only challenge they escaped was facing Kenyon at Kenyon with a Final Four spot on the line, but of course based on Kenyon's tournament failures and Centre's form maybe Centre would have advanced anyway.  Centre has several good offensive players, and Garuba is as good as anyone in the country.  Centre has to hope that they can keep the game tight long enough for Garuba to be a difference-maker.  It is most likely that Amherst will overwhelm the Colonels with Centre finding themselves down 2-0 before they can gain a grip on the match, so Amherst could win 3-0 or 4-0.  I hope I'm wrong.

Prediction....Calvin finally gets by Tufts in a classic semi, and then proceeds to lose again in the national final to a will-not-be-denied Amherst squad.

Congrats to Tufts, Calvin and Amherst....very clearly the top three programs in the country right now with Messiah next at #4.  A less advertised stat for Amherst that may challenge Tufts' four out of six Final Fours is Amherst's 14 or 15 in a row minimum of Sweet 16s.  I do think the top New England sides tend to get a pretty clear road to the Sweet 16, but still, 14 or 15 straight NCAA appearances plus never losing on the first weekend is impressive.

[Falconer]

Congrats to Tufts, Calvin and Amherst....very clearly the top three programs in the country right now with Messiah next at #4.  A less advertised stat for Amherst that may challenge Tufts' four out of six Final Fours is Amherst's 14 or 15 in a row minimum of Sweet 16s.  I do think the top New England sides tend to get a pretty clear road to the Sweet 16, but still, 14 or 15 straight NCAA appearances plus never losing on the first weekend is impressive.

I probably agree with your analysis here, PN. On another day, Messiah probably advances to play Amherst for a spot in the Final Four, but RPI is awfully good too--clearly better IMO than Oneonta (e.g.), although Oneonta merits a top 15 ranking. They looked bad at times yesterday, but as has been pointed out, gameday conditions were hardly fair. It's never actually fair, IMO, for teams to be forced to play on smaller fields, even without the field conditions, which were huge yesterday. Soccer isn't supposed to be like MLB, which has always had differences in home parks factor into the game as well-known factors that even out over a season. D3 soccer, especially including the tournament, is what it is. It's fair, insofar as the seeding and hosting is supposed to be determined by objective criteria; but, it's never fair if the same teams always get to play on their own inferior fields every year, giving them very large advantages. At least the Final Four itself removes that factor--and fairly so. Whoever wins that has legitimate bragging rights--and, maybe that will still be Amherst.

And, as I forgot to say, RPI defeated Oneonta this season. Another reason to say what I did.

[lastguyoffthebench]

https://mobile.twitter.com/CentreAthletics/status/1198709772121497600?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1198709772121497600&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcentrecolonels.com%2Fnews%2F2019%2F11%2F24%2Fmens-soccer-barth-newton-extend-magical-season-with-late-goals-send-colonels-to-final-four.aspx

The joy of a first ever trip to the Final Four...

The equalizer wasn't much better.  About everything just went wrong for MSU in the final moments.   Miskick, slip, bad clearance.  Goal 
Congrats to Centre...However, that is flat out the worst defending I have ever seen in an Elite 8

[Hopkins92]

https://mobile.twitter.com/CentreAthletics/status/1198709772121497600?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1198709772121497600&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcentrecolonels.com%2Fnews%2F2019%2F11%2F24%2Fmens-soccer-barth-newton-extend-magical-season-with-late-goals-send-colonels-to-final-four.aspx

The joy of a first ever trip to the Final Four...

Congrats to Centre...However, that is flat out the worst defending I have ever seen in an Elite 8

Woooooooooow. That is horrific.

[Gregory Sager]

A great year for the NESCAC with three teams in the elite eight (and Conn only eliminated by a conference foe). Could we have an all-NESCAC final? The Calvin Tufts game should be phenomenal. Don't know too much about Centre though...any idea how they play/what to watch for?

I watched a lot of their game with MSU, in which Centre dominated the stats but was trailing 2-1 late in regulation. I can only go with the eye test on a very limited range of data--it's the only time I've seen either team play this year. IMO, they aren't as good at either end of the field as Messiah or Hopkins or F&M, to name 3 teams I know pretty well, but it goes without saying that you don't get to the Final Four by fooling people with mirrors--they beat 3 darn good teams and a decent team in K'zoo, so they are no fluke. I agree they are the weakest link in the Final Four, but they are still in that group this year. Now watch them win it all, which I would thoroughly enjoy. Please make me eat these words. :-)

The big target (Alexander Garuba) is a legitimate threat, even though he had just one assist yesterday. He got the bulk of the defensive attention. I am prepared to believe that his 23 goals scored this year would have been similar against a tougher schedule. He has some help up front, too--if you give him too much attention, someone else will be open and make you pay. Defensively they can be beaten, and I expect someone like Amherst or Tufts to take advantage of them, perhaps early in the game.

Just Amherst and Tufts? Granted, I've only seen parts of two Centre games this season, but I've seen enough of the Centre defense to know that Calvin would probably eat them alive. F'rinstance, while that was terrible D by Montclair State on Centre's golden goal, there were defensive goofs that I saw earlier in OT at the other end of the pitch that MSU failed to capitalize upon.

Having said that ...

It is most likely that Amherst will overwhelm the Colonels with Centre finding themselves down 2-0 before they can gain a grip on the match, so Amherst could win 3-0 or 4-0.  I hope I'm wrong.

I agree. I'm pulling for the Colonels. Nothing I'd love more than to see an unheralded newcomer to the national scene -- especially one that's never been past the second round prior to this season -- knock out a constantly-hyped member of the old guard in the Final Four. But I just don't see it happening this time.

It's never actually fair, IMO, for teams to be forced to play on smaller fields, even without the field conditions, which were huge yesterday. Soccer isn't supposed to be like MLB, which has always had differences in home parks factor into the game as well-known factors that even out over a season. D3 soccer, especially including the tournament, is what it is. It's fair, insofar as the seeding and hosting is supposed to be determined by objective criteria; but, it's never fair if the same teams always get to play on their own inferior fields every year, giving them very large advantages.

What is the reason for your complaint? Is Amherst's Hitchcock Field smaller than 70/75 x 115/120?

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

As long as the field meets the NCAA minimum, they are fine. Minimum is 70x115. Max 75x120 - unless built before 1995 ... but I think those are usually not allowed to host (unless extenuating circumstances).

If we are talking about weather making a grass field unplayable ... that happens. The weather in New England this weekend was ... well ... wicked! Not much one can do about that and I don't expect a committee to say, "well since weather could be lousy, Amherst shouldn't host."

The field hockey championships were played after snow was pushed off the field in Penn. this past weekend.

The field is part of the elements one has to adapt to in soccer ... it actually sucks, IMO, that there are so many turf fields now (with countless lines; side note, Sager ... you were seeing soccer, FH, and both lacrosse lines - the worst is when football is also on full display).

Per hosting, there are other things involved in hosting other than geography and "seeding." That doesn't mean Amherst didn't qualify.

[blooter442]

Congrats to Centre...However, that is flat out the worst defending I have ever seen in an Elite 8

At risk of sounding like a broken record — nah, that ship has sailed — the first 20 minutes of their performance in last year's Elite 8 has to be comparable.

[Buddham]

The ascetics of a soccer-only field (without the rainbow mazes of other lines) shouldn't be under-estimated. Saw a game at Yale where the visitors got confused as to exactly which lines they were playing.

A technical, possession-oriented team might benefit from playing in tight confines using quick one-touches to play through traffic. Conversely, a larger field might favor a long-ball kick and run team with speedsters because they'd have the space to outpace their opponents. The muck gives the player with the ball the advantage and possession looked fairly even between RPI and Amherst (I think?).

Regardless, RPI walked out with jackets on before the kickoff. The climate seemed to have gotten in their heads, and that might have impacted their feet. Channeling the Green Bay Packers and coming out in short sleeves might have sent a stronger message.

[cciw83]

Centre is the Cinderella and Amherst will definitely be the favorite. Some of the analysis on Centre on watching part of a game is a little bit off. Their two centerbacks are veterans and one of the main strengths of the team, one has been playing a little dinged up and the time off will help. Their starting GK for the season was injured in the conference tournament championship game and has not played in the tournament. There is a chance he will be back for the semi-finals.  The outside backs like to get up the field, high risk/high reward. It has been working the tournament, we'll see against Amherst.

Have seen Garuba several times he is quality at any level.

[Gregory Sager]

As long as the field meets the NCAA minimum, they are fine. Minimum is 70x115. Max 75x120 - unless built before 1995 ... but I think those are usually not allowed to host (unless extenuating circumstances).

The rules actually say that the field has to have been used as a college soccer field before 1995, not "built before 1995" -- so you can't, for instance, take an old practice field that's never been used for games and retroactively use it as a legit varsity pitch.

The Pre-Championships Manual says that standard 70/75 x 115/120 fields have "preference" for hosting, while also noting the pre-'95 exception.

If we are talking about weather making a grass field unplayable ... that happens. The weather in New England this weekend was ... well ... wicked! Not much one can do about that and I don't expect a committee to say, "well since weather could be lousy, Amherst shouldn't host."

The field hockey championships were played after snow was pushed off the field in Penn. this past weekend.

The field is part of the elements one has to adapt to in soccer ... it actually sucks, IMO, that there are so many turf fields now (with countless lines; side note, Sager ... you were seeing soccer, FH, and both lacrosse lines - the worst is when football is also on full display).

I think that the multi-use stadia in CCIW country tend to line for women's lacrosse after New Year's Day, which is why I'm not used to seeing those lines. All I ever get to see in the spring are baseball and softball diamonds.

I get that some people have an aesthetic distaste for an artificial surface for soccer, but with end-of-season weather conditions being what they are in the northern tier of states and the fact that multitudes of D3 schools have resource limitations that force them to double up on fields and/or use cost-effective surfaces, it only stands to reason that more and more schools are going to opt for turf. But not all turf fields are the same; I know that I sound like a pitchman, but I love Field Turf.

The ascetics of a soccer-only field (without the rainbow mazes of other lines) shouldn't be under-estimated. Saw a game at Yale where the visitors got confused as to exactly which lines they were playing.

I wouldn't call that aesthetics as much as a genuine potential hazard. I've heard of instances of a goalkeeper getting confused on a multi-lined pitch as to where the edge of the 18 was. But you can't use that as an excuse; it's incumbent upon a team when visiting a multi-lined pitch to familiarize itself with the relevant lines while it's warming up. It's not as though the other lines magically appear once the ref whistles in-play at the start of the game.

A technical, possession-oriented team might benefit from playing in tight confines using quick one-touches to play through traffic. Conversely, a larger field might favor a long-ball kick and run team with speedsters because they'd have the space to outpace their opponents. The muck gives the player with the ball the advantage and possession looked fairly even between RPI and Amherst (I think?).

Regardless, RPI walked out with jackets on before the kickoff. The climate seemed to have gotten in their heads, and that might have impacted their feet. Channeling the Green Bay Packers and coming out in short sleeves might have sent a stronger message.

And that's definitely on the Engineers. They didn't bus into a different climatic zone when traveling the 80 or so miles from Troy, NY to Amherst, MA.