UAA soccer 2021

[deiscanton]

Standings at the end of Matchday #3

1.)  NYU-- 9 points, +5 goal differential

2.)  Emory-- 5 points, +1 goal differential

3.)  Wash U-- 4 points, +1 goal differential

4.)  CWRU-- 4 points, -1 goal differential, (4 goals scored in UAA play, head-to-head win vs Brandeis)

5.)  Brandeis-- 4 points, -1 goal differential (2 goals scored in UAA play)

6.)  Chicago-- 3 points, -1 goal differential

7.)  Rochester-- 3 points, -2 goal differential

8.)  Carnegie Mellon-- 1 point, -2 goal differential

[jaybird44]

A few quick thoughts on last night's NYU/WashU tilt...

NYU was the better team last night, and perhaps every night...the Violets are physical, they have skill, and they were quicker than WashU.  That was readily apparent when WashU's methodical passing game approach to its offense was more often scrapped in favor of the long-pass launches from the backs.  NYU effectively suffocated WashU's intent to move the ball skillfully upfield.

As a result of all that, WashU fell into the trap of hoping that the officials would help them level the playing field.  Lots of on-field complaining, and perhaps for good reason.  But, that gets in the way of trying to find a way on the field to be more creative...or to at least get in the penalty area with regularity to where you might get a penalty called on the vigorous Violets.

And the officiating crew was clearly not up to the challenge of legislating a match in which both teams like the rough-and-tumble and the chirping from players that sometimes goes with that.  I feel for the crew, because that was a very difficult match to officiate.  My biggest issue was the frequent stoppages of play, so the lead official could scold players like he was a father or a teacher trying to plead and implore them to change their behavior.  That resulted in a scheduled 90-minute match to go well past two hours--without overtime.  At some point, the lead official needed to stop scolding and issue more yellow cards.  That would've eventually caused a 1 + 1 = red card situation or two that would have gotten the players' attention and desired behavior modification, IMHO.

[Buck O.]

That is a stunning result, while admitting I know less than nothing about Mt St Vincent.  And the box score references the NYU GK on both goals.
Doesn't actually hurt NYU much except with silly poll voters.  And maybe their confidence takes a mild hit, but will not impact RvR or at large chances hardly at all.

That seems to be an indictment of the current procedure for selecting teams.  One game doesn't mean everything, but losing to the team that is currently ranked #263 by Massey should be a significant hit.

NCAA Division III does not allow selection committees to use outside polls or outside computer algorithms as part of the primary or secondary selection criteria. 

That is not what I was suggesting.  I referred to Mt. St. Vincent's standing in the Massey rankings to illustrate the point that Mt. St. Vincent's is not a very good team (despite their glossy record, which has been compiled against weak competition other than the NYU game).  My point remains that losses to worse teams should hurt more than losses to better teams, and to the extent that the current tournament selection procedures lead to the opposite outcome, it demonstrates the need to revise those procedures.

[deiscanton]

That is a stunning result, while admitting I know less than nothing about Mt St Vincent.  And the box score references the NYU GK on both goals.
Doesn't actually hurt NYU much except with silly poll voters.  And maybe their confidence takes a mild hit, but will not impact RvR or at large chances hardly at all.

That seems to be an indictment of the current procedure for selecting teams.  One game doesn't mean everything, but losing to the team that is currently ranked #263 by Massey should be a significant hit.

NCAA Division III does not allow selection committees to use outside polls or outside computer algorithms as part of the primary or secondary selection criteria. 

That is not what I was suggesting.  I referred to Mt. St. Vincent's standing in the Massey rankings to illustrate the point that Mt. St. Vincent's is not a very good team (despite their glossy record, which has been compiled against weak competition other than the NYU game).  My point remains that losses to worse teams should hurt more than losses to better teams, and to the extent that the current tournament selection procedures lead to the opposite outcome, it demonstrates the need to revise those procedures.

Buck O, you are still referring to an outside ranking (Massey) to compare the teams as to who is better or worse-- , which under NCAA DIII Selection rules set by the DIII Championships Committee, is not allowed for selection purposes, for various reasons. To the extent that a selection procedure may or may not need review, that is up to the DIII Championships Committee, and the selection rules for DIII have to apply fairly across the board to cover all DIII sports.  Right now, the only four applicable comparisons in the primary selection criteria that one can make between NYU and Mt. St. Vincent soccer for purposes of at-large consideration (if needed) are head-to-head, winning pct, Strength of schedule, and results vs teams ranked in evaluation regions.  The fourth criterion does not take effect until the rankings start getting compiled for the October 27, 2021 (Week 2) regional rankings.

The head to head result between NYU and Mt. St. Vincent could be considered if both teams need at-large bids in the end, and both teams were at the top of their respective evaluation regions on the table, thereby being on the national table for consideration. Both teams are in different evaluation regions right now(Mt. St. Vincent is in Evaluation Region III, and NYU is in Evaluation Region IV).  Even under the old regional alignment, the two teams were in different evaluation regions (Atlantic and East, respectively.)  Correction:  Mt. St. Vincent and NYU were both in the East Region in soccer in the 2019 season-- I confused the basketball regional alignment for the soccer regional alignment.  Sorry about that.

Adjustments to the tournament selection criteria are in the jurisdiction of the DIII Championships Committee, and may not be necessary to be made this year, considering that NYU is currently in position for the UAA's AQ through 3 matchdays, and with a win later this afternoon, would enter the mid-season UAA conference break in the lead for the UAA Championship and AQ with a least a 4 point lead.  Even in the worst case scenario this afternoon, the NYU men would be leading the UAA standings by 1 point going into the conference break.

An NYU win later this afternoon at Chicago would say a lot more about NYU's chances of making the NCAAs than a loss earlier this week in a non-league game.

[deiscanton]

For people watching on video today--

Under the UAA Soccer Code of Conduct, because it is the second match of a 2 match conference weekend, the away team will be wearing their home uniforms while the home team will be wearing their road uniforms today.

This will be repeated on Matchday #6 on October 31, 2021.

[PaulNewman]

Deisman, Buck O is an experienced and renowned poster in his own right, and certainly doesn't need me to jump in, but I think he originally was responding to something I posted.

It's not just Massey.  None of the rankings, with the exception for the NCAA regional rankings still to come, count for anything in terms of selection criteria.  And one can fully understand the selection criteria and muse about little quirks that you're probably right won't change, but still....to give a hypothetical, it is an odd thing that a double OT loss to Tufts or Messiah can actually hurt a team more a loss to NVU-Lyndon or Medgar Evers.  Midd losing to Green Mountain Valley State won't hurt them as much as a a very close loss to Amherst, although I suppose one could argue that a loss (or a win) to a 1-16 team hurts SoS.  Of course that little caveat doesn't apply to the Mt St Vincent example since they have a very good record, so one might even argue that a loss to them HELPs NYU.

Now, all that said, if NYU pulls off the road UAA double today, then I would argue that wins over Wash U and Chicago completely nullify any hit NYU might have been expecting in any national polls or even the D3 fan poll here.  If they win again today I for instance won't drop them a bit and would consider raising them, although that's hard given the firmness of the top 3 and Trinity still being unblemished.

I'm surprised no one mentioned how close Mancuso against Wash U was to getting another yellow and thus another red with another suspension.  His suspension just before the last game certainly didn't seem to put a damper on his aggressiveness.

[deiscanton]

I'm surprised no one mentioned how close Mancuso against Wash U was to getting another yellow and thus another red with another suspension.  His suspension just before the last game certainly didn't seem to put a damper on his aggressiveness.

If memory serves me right from the NCAA Soccer Rules Book, a player getting a second red card of the season gets a 2 match suspension, and would have to sit out the next 2 matches (1 game for each red card given.)  Mancuso is going to have to be very careful the rest of the season.

So far, Mancuso is going into today's match vs Chicago with 2 yellows and 1 red card on the season.

[PaulNewman]

I'm surprised no one mentioned how close Mancuso against Wash U was to getting another yellow and thus another red with another suspension.  His suspension just before the last game certainly didn't seem to put a damper on his aggressiveness.

If memory serves me right from the NCAA Soccer Rules Book, a player getting a second red card of the season gets a 2 match suspension, and would have to sit out the next 2 matches (1 game for each red card given.)  Mancuso is going to have to be very careful the rest of the season.

So far, Mancuso is going into today's match vs Chicago with 2 yellows and 1 red card on the season.

Right, that was kind of my point.  Doesn't look like he has any intentions of being careful.  Maybe Wyant thinks the team needs him to play with max aggression and is willing to take the risks.

[PaulNewman]

I spent a lot of money sending my daughter to Rochester.  Love much about the school, but the continued paywall for video is offensive.

[deiscanton]

I spent a lot of money sending my daughter to Rochester.  Love much about the school, but the continued paywall for video is offensive.

I understand completely.  I only pay the $10.95 monthly subscription fee to Rochester during basketball season.  Even if you are only going to watch 1 game, it is easier to subscribe for 1 month and then cancel it after you pay for the month so that you can have access to video for the site for the next 30 days.

[deiscanton]

Halftime in the early games--

Emory 0, Carnegie Mellon 0

Rochester 0, CWRU 0

Wash U and Chicago are both going through their Senior Day ceremonies.  Their respective games of Brandeis at Wash U and NYU at Chicago will kick off shortly-- around 1:45 PM Central/2:45 PM Eastern.

[deiscanton]

Chicago strikes first in the 7th minute on a goal from Ryan Yetishefsky, assist from Ryan Shea.

Chicago leads NYU, 1-0, early in the match.

Elsewhere, Rochester has taken the lead over CWRU, 1-0, on a goal from Santi Ponce Ocampo in the 55th minute.  The goal came off a throw-in and the kick came from 15 yards out to the upper left corner of the net.

In the second half, early,

Emory 0, Carnegie Mellon 0 in the 47th minute.

Wash U 0, Brandeis 0 in the 14th minute.

[deiscanton]

Update--

Emory now leads, 1-0, over Carnegie Mellon on a goal from Charlle Scruton in the 53rd minute, assist from Trey Rielly.

[deiscanton]

It is now Chicago 2, NYU 0 on a penalty kick goal from Naz Kabbani in the 16th minute.  First goal of the season from Kabbani.  No card issued to NYU on the foul that occured in NYU's penalty box that led to the penalty kick goal.

[deiscanton]

Rochester now leading over CWRU, 2-0, on a goal from Othman Belhseine in the 62nd minute.