2022 Season Game Notes

[Gregory Sager]

The Coach?

I don't have historical knowledge,  only know Ruben Burke is super highly regarded as someone who is straightforward and transparent during recruiting-- and he works hard at it. I definitely saw a correlation with successful programs and coaches that put effort into recruiting.  I know that's only one element of a successful program, but I expect that effort carries over to the other aspects.

Yes, I absolutely believe the coach is the biggest factor (presuming relatively similar desirability of the schools being discussed).  But what goes into getting that coach?  Burk is incredible...could not have been more impressed with him.  But who picked him and why?  His resume certainly wasn't glaringly obvious.  Maybe more importantly, what are the factors that result in ending up with a less than stellar coach?

All about the coach in college soccer.
Coach is the Coach.
Coach is also the GM as well as the PR guy.
In mu opinion, the best coach is the guy who was a good player based on effort more than ability, but with that eye to catch and scout the ability when he sees it.
They can then get into the mindset of those talented players and give them and the team what is necessary to succeed at that high level. Work ethic.
The mind game is where a coach has to succeed even more than X and O coaching.
You have a diverse bunch of young men 17-22 who are already super confident (a good thing) in their abilities.
The coach has to: caress/build -up/manage those egos at a time in life for young men where this is not easy to do.
Foster competition while maintaining a high degree of love and respect in the team. Hard balance


Some of the best in the business over the past 30, from Williams to Tufts and Ohio Weslyan and Messiah and Wheaton  in between have had coaches that built more families than programs. The men who know how to do this are the real good coaches.

Good coaching starts with getting the most talented players possible that fit your school's profile onto your campus and into your program's kit. There's an old expression in college football -- "It's not the X's and O's, it's the Jimmys and Joes" -- that holds true in every college sport. Not to downplay all of the things that you mentioned about mentality and ego management, which are very important, but you can orchestrate your group of young men into one tightly-knit, maximum-effort unit that would charge the guns at Balaklava at your command, and they're still not going to be a winning team if they don't have the talent. Of course, soccer is more generous in that superior talent is somewhat less likely to lead to sure victory on a given day than it is in other sports, but over the course of a season talent still wins out.

Recruiting is the dominant responsibility of a coaching staff in intercollegiate sports, and soccer is no exception.

[Coach Jeff]

Two of my sons have played or are playing D3 Soccer.  They have had great experiences but one thing I noticed that was different between the two colleges was that one program's coaching staff took the current players input about a recruits on campus visit into consideration.  In other words if the players felt the player wasn't a good fit for the team culture the coaches would reevaluate the recruit.  The other school would bring the player in and try to mold the player into the culture.  Both programs are fairly successful.  One thing they had in common was the coaches spent a lot of time learning about our sons outside of soccer.  They were interested in family life, hobbies, career aspirations, world view etc.  They empathized that they were recruiting the whole person not just the player.  It was very reassuring for us as parents.

[Gregory Sager]

Two of my sons have played or are playing D3 Soccer.  They have had great experiences but one thing I noticed that was different between the two colleges was that one program's coaching staff took the current players input about a recruits on campus visit into consideration.  In other words if the players felt the player wasn't a good fit for the team culture the coaches would reevaluate the recruit.  The other school would bring the player in and try to mold the player into the culture.  Both programs are fairly successful.

Interesting. I would say that there's risk/reward with both approaches. It depends upon the coach's charisma and strength of personality, I think, to really get buy-in from a recruit whose older peers didn't view him as "a good fit," because otherwise the coach could be playing with fire. On the other hand, 20- and 21-year-olds don't know everything and aren't always the greatest evaluators of other people, especially within the short time frame of a recruiting visit -- and you don't want to miss out by losing a future All-American (especially if he ends up at a school in your league!) just because one of your players misread the kid's vibe on a campus visit.

One thing they had in common was the coaches spent a lot of time learning about our sons outside of soccer.  They were interested in family life, hobbies, career aspirations, world view etc.  They empathized that they were recruiting the whole person not just the player.  It was very reassuring for us as parents.

This is important, too, Most parents are not dummies. They can sense if a coach intrinsically values their kid as a human being or if he views their kid as a potentially high-functioning cog in a machine.

It works the other way around, too. Coaches have to evaluate parents as well. I love this video by Notre Dame men's basketball coach Mike Brey about that side of the relationship:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z62AuGXuyiw

[Falconer]

Messiah sure better win the national title or at least get to the final.  Given that they are three deep with AAs at every position a few injuries even to "key" players won't be a legitimate excuse given what we've heard here.  And how in the world did Tufts win four titles without the crutch of that Muhlenberg field?

I knew I'd get your goat with that, PN. If the truth be told, that goat is easy to catch. 

Just two comments coming back at you.

(1) IMO the three key players—the guys who can't be replaced in the lineup without a significant loss in quality of play—are Groothoff, Macdonald, and Lent-Koop. The players who back them up are good enough to start for most teams, but not (at least presently) on the same level. Groothoff really is to Messiah what Messi  has been to his club and national teams: he sets people up to score, including sometimes himself. He's irreplaceable, and when he went down for the season last October I knew the Falcons weren't going to win it all. That hasn't changed. Likewise, losing either of the other two guys would seriously hinder their chances. CB Lent-Koop is to Messiah what Muther is to Kenyon—one of the very few truly elite defenders in D3, and everyone now knows who Macdonald is. Anyone else, relatively speaking, is a speed bump with their depth.

(2) Unquestionably, Tufts proved over several years that they were on the same level with Messiah. Nothing takes away from that, including the awful conditions on that field. However, to be fair and frank, I think it was you yourself on this board who said of that group of Falcons, that 3 of them were each individually better than anyone in NESCAC, by which I took you to mean that they would be listed 1, 2, and 3 from that imaginary sample set. I agreed with that. In other words, it's understandable if I believed (and still do) that the one Tufts-Messiah game we have actually seen had a fluke result: a deflected shot in the first minute that got past the keeper, while the field itself greatly hindered the beautiful game Messiah plays. Tufts obviously had the same field to play on. They won and deserve the accolades, but they weren't the better team that year—clearly they were in the next few seasons, though in 2017 they probably weren't. We'll never be able to answer that particular question.

Knowing you well, PN, you'll probably come right back at me, but I have nothing more to say about this one. My best to you, my friend.

[PaulNewman]

Oh, Falconer, just so you know, my friend, you don't always remember to fully secure the gate on your own goat farm, although to be fair, you do have by far the best goats and by far the best fields for them to graze on. 

No worries.  Glad to see you so excited about your team.  With a little good fortune, you'll be able to avoid any apologist posts down the line related to injuries, a tough field, an unlucky draw, teams being overly physical, fluke plays so good they carry a team all the way to a national title, any inclement weather that might hamper execution of their wildly superior skills and playing style, bad refs, or even the one in a zillion chance that a team might actually outplay the Falcons on the day.

Loved your insight on Juantorena.

[PaulNewman]

Beep, beep, beep....This is a test of the National Broadcast System....This is just a test...beep, beep, beep...

Chicago has the best two CBs in the country.

Beep, beep, beep...This has been a test of the National Broadcast System...Now we return you to your regular programming.

[MessageBoardMessi]

Beep, beep, beep....This is a test of the National Broadcast System....This is just a test...beep, beep, beep...

Chicago has the best two CBs in the country.

Beep, beep, beep...This has been a test of the National Broadcast System...Now we return you to your regular programming.

After Messiahs Lent-Koop. Beep, Beep, Beep

[PaulNewman]

Gotta love some of the new cool features on these 3rd generation burner accounts.....now come factory pre-installed with their own goats.  Quaint.

[MessageBoardMessi]

Gotta love some of the new cool features on these 3rd generation burner accounts.....now come factory pre-installed with their own goats.  Quaint.

As a new, first generation, never been on here before or tended a goat in my life account - I must have missed an unwritten rule or two on ones ability to simply banter no different that others on this board.  Saying that, let me try this in what I hope to be a more palatable way......

Mr. Newman, that is an interesting take regarding the CBs at Chicago.  In your humble yet expert opinion, do you feel that they are better than Messiah's Lent Koop?  I only ask because that kid is pretty much a stud, and I don't think I have seen him make a mistake all season....not to mention the fact he also has 5 ish goals based on his ability to be a force on set pieces and full field runs.  Would love to hear  what you have discerned about the Chicago CBs.....

[northman]

I don't know how anyone can declare any single team's CBs the absolute two best in D3 nationally...unless they have exhaustively studied every CB this season among the 300+ D3 programs...  Just sayin'...

[PaulNewman]

Gotta love some of the new cool features on these 3rd generation burner accounts.....now come factory pre-installed with their own goats.  Quaint.

As a new, first generation, never been on here before or tended a goat in my life account - I must have missed an unwritten rule or two on ones ability to simply banter no different that others on this board.  Saying that, let me try this in what I hope to be a more palatable way......

Mr. Newman, that is an interesting take regarding the CBs at Chicago.  In your humble yet expert opinion, do you feel that they are better than Messiah's Lent Koop?  I only ask because that kid is pretty much a stud, and I don't think I have seen him make a mistake all season....not to mention the fact he also has 5 ish goals based on his ability to be a force on set pieces and full field runs.  Would love to hear  what you have discerned about the Chicago CBs.....

The truth is I have no idea and in general agree with northman.  There are a lot of VERY good CBs on very good teams around the country.  I haven't watched Lent-Koop much at all despite the begging to watch all of Messiah's great plays and goals.  The drooling and self-congratulation always send me a little over the edge....and hence why I'm so "goatable."  I've watched the Chicago guys several times and they are superb.  All three -- Kent-Loop and Gillespie and Wada were FIRST TEAM D3soccer.com AAs last year with Gillespie winning national Defender of the Year.

From the D3soccer.com website....

Richard Gillespie of Chicago is the D3soccer.com Defender of the Year, teaming with fellow junior Griffin Wada to form the nation's best center back pairing. Despite playing one of the toughest schedules in Division III, the Maroon defense ranked fourth in goals conceded (0.47 GAA), posted 13 shutouts (twice each against high-scoring Calvin and North Park), and only conceded multiple goals in a game once. Chicago trailed for less than 91 minutes all season (the least by percentage in the nation) despite a low 1.32 goal scoring average. Credit goes to Gillespie & Co. who not only held opponents to just 7.0 shot attempts on average (5th best) but did even better limiting quality looks as reflected in a nation-leading 2.29 shots on goal allowed per game. They were the stingiest defense in the NCAA tournament, not conceding a single goal until the 18th minute of overtime in the national semifinal. Gillespie also contributed offensively with five goals and a pair of assists, all but one coming with the game still scoreless, often in the second half. The versatile defender was highly effective with both his head (2g, 1a) and feet (3g) inside the eighteen on set pieces.

I have paid attention to McDonald and he is a great player.  Chicago has its own lethal offensive players...Yetishefsky, Kai Walsh, Alex Lee, Lyndon Hu. 

[PaulNewman]

I don't know how anyone can declare any single team's CBs the absolute two best in D3 nationally...unless they have exhaustively studied every CB this season among the 300+ D3 programs...  Just sayin'...

While as you'll see above  that I agree with you, I am not sure an exhaustive search would come up with a better tandem.

[MessageBoardMessi]

I don't know how anyone can declare any single team's CBs the absolute two best in D3 nationally...unless they have exhaustively studied every CB this season among the 300+ D3 programs...  Just sayin'...

While as you'll see above  that I agree with you, I am not sure an exhaustive search would come up with a better tandem.

Thanks for the additional detail on your take, and for citing your source.  the one thing that I find the most difficult in determining the "best" players or outcomes is what seems to be a lack of parity between conferences and teams across the country. I know that this may key up a good discussion around the strongest conferences -  but there still seems to be a huge divide between teams - even in a single conference.  W&L is on a different planet compared to Guilford just like Messiah compared to Hood or Albright.  I am sure there are similar examples across the other conferences. So - how do you get close to apples to apples  - or can you ahead of the NCAA Tourney when the parity gets a bit more normalized......I think that is what makes the tourney even more interesting......while you may have dominated all season, are you the real deal, or have you simply been the tallest person in a room full of short folks???

[PaulNewman]

I don't know how anyone can declare any single team's CBs the absolute two best in D3 nationally...unless they have exhaustively studied every CB this season among the 300+ D3 programs...  Just sayin'...

While as you'll see above  that I agree with you, I am not sure an exhaustive search would come up with a better tandem.

Thanks for the additional detail on your take, and for citing your source.  the one thing that I find the most difficult in determining the "best" players or outcomes is what seems to be a lack of parity between conferences and teams across the country. I know that this may key up a good discussion around the strongest conferences -  but there still seems to be a huge divide between teams - even in a single conference.  W&L is on a different planet compared to Guilford just like Messiah compared to Hood or Albright.  I am sure there are similar examples across the other conferences. So - how do you get close to apples to apples  - or can you ahead of the NCAA Tourney when the parity gets a bit more normalized......I think that is what makes the tourney even more interesting......while you may have dominated all season, are you the real deal, or have you simply been the tallest person in a room full of short folks???

Sure, but that doesn't apply to Chicago who year in and year have one of the very highest SoSs in the country.  It DOES apply, as you note, to Messiah (who schedules well and usually has a good SoS anc obviously cannot control the weakness of the conference).  Not getting your thing with W&L or frankly with Guilford and short people.  Odd.

[MessageBoardMessi]

I don't know how anyone can declare any single team's CBs the absolute two best in D3 nationally...unless they have exhaustively studied every CB this season among the 300+ D3 programs...  Just sayin'...

While as you'll see above  that I agree with you, I am not sure an exhaustive search would come up with a better tandem.

Thanks for the additional detail on your take, and for citing your source.  the one thing that I find the most difficult in determining the "best" players or outcomes is what seems to be a lack of parity between conferences and teams across the country. I know that this may key up a good discussion around the strongest conferences -  but there still seems to be a huge divide between teams - even in a single conference.  W&L is on a different planet compared to Guilford just like Messiah compared to Hood or Albright.  I am sure there are similar examples across the other conferences. So - how do you get close to apples to apples  - or can you ahead of the NCAA Tourney when the parity gets a bit more normalized......I think that is what makes the tourney even more interesting......while you may have dominated all season, are you the real deal, or have you simply been the tallest person in a room full of short folks???

Sure, but that doesn't apply to Chicago who year in and year have one of the very highest SoSs in the country.  It DOES apply, as you note, to Messiah (who schedules well and usually has a good SoS anc obviously cannot control the weakness of the conference).  Not getting your thing with W&L or frankly with Guilford and short people.  Odd.

Washington and Lee - Good.  Guilford - BAd.  Messiah - Good , Hood  - Bad.  If you are 5'7 in a room full of people that are 5"5, are you tall?  No.  Just taller than the other short people.  Its an analogy.  Hoping that helps......

In the meantime, I will look a little closer at the power conference that Chicago seems to be a part of.....