2023 D3 Men's Soccer National Perspective

Started by PaulNewman, July 19, 2023, 06:31:33 PM

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PaulNewman

Quote from: Another Mom on September 21, 2023, 09:52:32 AM
We are definitely friends! Question: is your username wildly coincidental to W&L, or do you have a connection to the school/team?

I'm happy to share insights; the team still has Agbeyegbe, the ODAC Rookie of the year, and a high scorer in past seasons. And McCarty, who has great soccer IQ. Adler was hugely effective last year.  PJ Ryan is a 3 year starter, with accolades, etc, so although losing especially Kutsanzira as well as Bass and Smith is tough, as I say I still believe there's a lot of talent still on the roster. Plus a couple of the 1st years are making a mark, including Kaba, who scored last night's goal.

Fwiw, I personally would rank Smith and Bass above Kutsanzira in terms of impact of the loss.  Same with Kenyon...you can't expect a handful of 3 and 4 year starters who have won conference midfielder of year or offensive poy, etc, to just hit the ground running with no adjustment period.

PaulNewman

Quote from: Hopkins92 on September 21, 2023, 12:32:31 PM
I get a sense that in addition to the "don't provide the enemy intel," there is a confidence/intimidation thing going on.

With that said, this place used to have some pretty cantankerous exchanges and some personal conflagrations that... hoo boy... really turned me off from posting/participating.

Thankfully, most of that heat has dissipated. Even the "debate" around Amherst has settled into an "agree to disagree" tone that is at worst a civil discussion at this point. I also think the tone and atmosphere here doesn't really put up or allow for people to get nasty or to extend a heated discussion for too long. And people tend to try and be respectful of other perspectives.

I know I was coming on here slagging on F&M in my early days. I wouldn't say I've changed my tune 100 percent, but I certainly have more context for the program and an appreciation over the years of their consistent success.

100%...and since I got caught up in or maybe even sparked some cantankerous exchanges, I am proof that maturity can still increase after age 55 (OK, after 60...boy that is hard to write because I feel like I'm 11).  As one example which honestly did make a difference for me....deciding that I could embrace and even like Sager, and once that kicked in, he also was far more generous with me.

Kuiper

Quote from: Hopkins92 on September 21, 2023, 12:24:54 PM
So, yeah, interesting discussion.

Personal aside... I'm watching TV with The Wife last night and at some point I pop open the laptop to check on the Hopkins game. I skip-watch the game and then see it out live for the last 10... Still watching the show, but kind of spot checking the game. As soon as it ends, I hop over here and write a very brief summary (while she was on a bio break, mind you.) She comes back and says "oh boy, this again?" And, yeah, this again... I fully commit to this being a hobby of mine.

But, yeah, it's a pretty niche thing, to cover a D3 team and/or the conference or region they are in. I wouldn't expect this place to be flooded with posters. With that said, I wish more of the lurkers would come out. Especially parents* who have interesting insight that they could share without getting into hot water with info advantageous to their opponents.

* - I've had a handful of parents who don't really post much write me private messages either of appreciation or with insight that they can share but don't want out on these boards, which of course I respect.

I've had private messages as well with respect to my posts about schools out West.  I think there are two interesting aspects of people sending private messages rather than posting:

1.  The site is set up to favor long-time or very frequent posters.  You can't applaud/smite (what's up with "smite," by the way?  Sounds pretty extreme if we're just talking about disagree over something) unless you've reached a certain number of posts.  So, the only way you can simply encourage continued posting or register appreciation, is to write thanks in a post, which most people think isn't much of a contribution, or to do a private message, which I, for one, appreciate because I don't really know if ANYBODY reads my posts, but doesn't register much as activity on the board for frequent lurkers. 

2.  In my experience, many new posters are either new to D3 (because their kid just committed or started playing) or have kids considering playing in D3 and they are trying to learn more.  In neither case do the parents have a lot of strong opinions or takes to share on the board and very little information or perspective to share about other schools (e.g., if you are new to D3, you may have heard of some really well-known academic schools, but you probably have no idea which schools are traditional powers and you've probably never heard of the vast majority of schools unless you live in the general vicinity).  This is even a bigger issue in a place like the West Coast where there are very few D3 schools in the general vicinity.  My guess is very, very few schools, coaches, or parents, let alone players on the West Coast are aware that this board exists.  In fact, on the West Coast, it's only a small subset of parents or students who are aware that small liberal arts colleges in the Midwest, Mid-Atlantic, and Northeast exist.  And even among that small subset, they basically all know about the same few schools, they have no idea what "NESCAC" is, and most think D3 means rec soccer in college (like the Hollywood finance guy who said to me he really didn't want his kid, who was mediocre at best, to play soccer seriously in college - "I just want him to go play at a place like Amherst.").  For these new posters, the threads are great for information, but it's a one-way street.

Gregory Sager

Quote from: PaulNewman on September 21, 2023, 12:44:25 PM
100%...and since I got caught up in or maybe even sparked some cantankerous exchanges, I am proof that maturity can still increase after age 55 (OK, after 60...boy that is hard to write because I feel like I'm 11).  As one example which honestly did make a difference for me....deciding that I could embrace and even like Sager, and once that kicked in, he also was far more generous with me.

I guess I'm like vinegar on fries. You hate the very thought of it, and can't understand how anyone else could like it, until you wake up one day and suddenly realize that you're too old for ketchup. ;)
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

jknezek

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 21, 2023, 01:19:04 PM
Quote from: PaulNewman on September 21, 2023, 12:44:25 PM
100%...and since I got caught up in or maybe even sparked some cantankerous exchanges, I am proof that maturity can still increase after age 55 (OK, after 60...boy that is hard to write because I feel like I'm 11).  As one example which honestly did make a difference for me....deciding that I could embrace and even like Sager, and once that kicked in, he also was far more generous with me.

I guess I'm like vinegar on fries. You hate the very thought of it, and can't understand how anyone else could like it, until you wake up one day and suddenly realize that you're too old for ketchup. ;)

Oh man... them's fighting words to any Brits on here. And I love vinegar on fries, but I'll be darned if I can drink warm beer. Though to be fair, I don't much care for cold beer either.

PaulNewman

Quote from: Gregory Sager on September 21, 2023, 01:19:04 PM
Quote from: PaulNewman on September 21, 2023, 12:44:25 PM
100%...and since I got caught up in or maybe even sparked some cantankerous exchanges, I am proof that maturity can still increase after age 55 (OK, after 60...boy that is hard to write because I feel like I'm 11).  As one example which honestly did make a difference for me....deciding that I could embrace and even like Sager, and once that kicked in, he also was far more generous with me.

I guess I'm like vinegar on fries. You hate the very thought of it, and can't understand how anyone else could like it, until you wake up one day and suddenly realize that you're too old for ketchup. ;)

I would take a bullet for you, Mr. Sager.  Love ya.

Maine Soccer Fan

Quote from: Kuiper on September 21, 2023, 01:17:34 PM
Quote from: Hopkins92 on September 21, 2023, 12:24:54 PM
So, yeah, interesting discussion.

Personal aside... I'm watching TV with The Wife last night and at some point I pop open the laptop to check on the Hopkins game. I skip-watch the game and then see it out live for the last 10... Still watching the show, but kind of spot checking the game. As soon as it ends, I hop over here and write a very brief summary (while she was on a bio break, mind you.) She comes back and says "oh boy, this again?" And, yeah, this again... I fully commit to this being a hobby of mine.

But, yeah, it's a pretty niche thing, to cover a D3 team and/or the conference or region they are in. I wouldn't expect this place to be flooded with posters. With that said, I wish more of the lurkers would come out. Especially parents* who have interesting insight that they could share without getting into hot water with info advantageous to their opponents.

* - I've had a handful of parents who don't really post much write me private messages either of appreciation or with insight that they can share but don't want out on these boards, which of course I respect.

I've had private messages as well with respect to my posts about schools out West.  I think there are two interesting aspects of people sending private messages rather than posting:

1.  The site is set up to favor long-time or very frequent posters.  You can't applaud/smite (what's up with "smite," by the way?  Sounds pretty extreme if we're just talking about disagree over something) unless you've reached a certain number of posts.  So, the only way you can simply encourage continued posting or register appreciation, is to write thanks in a post, which most people think isn't much of a contribution, or to do a private message, which I, for one, appreciate because I don't really know if ANYBODY reads my posts, but doesn't register much as activity on the board for frequent lurkers. 

2.  In my experience, many new posters are either new to D3 (because their kid just committed or started playing) or have kids considering playing in D3 and they are trying to learn more.  In neither case do the parents have a lot of strong opinions or takes to share on the board and very little information or perspective to share about other schools (e.g., if you are new to D3, you may have heard of some really well-known academic schools, but you probably have no idea which schools are traditional powers and you've probably never heard of the vast majority of schools unless you live in the general vicinity).  This is even a bigger issue in a place like the West Coast where there are very few D3 schools in the general vicinity.  My guess is very, very few schools, coaches, or parents, let alone players on the West Coast are aware that this board exists.  In fact, on the West Coast, it's only a small subset of parents or students who are aware that small liberal arts colleges in the Midwest, Mid-Atlantic, and Northeast exist.  And even among that small subset, they basically all know about the same few schools, they have no idea what "NESCAC" is, and most think D3 means rec soccer in college (like the Hollywood finance guy who said to me he really didn't want his kid, who was mediocre at best, to play soccer seriously in college - "I just want him to go play at a place like Amherst.").  For these new posters, the threads are great for information, but it's a one-way street.

It wasn't until I moved to Maine from the West Coast when I was 44 that I ever heard of the term NESCAC. Which is funny because I:
1. Grew up in Maine and went to college in Mass
2. Have been married to a NESCAC grad since 1995

NESCACism is very provincial...

Gregory Sager

#367
Quote from: Kuiper on September 21, 2023, 01:17:34 PM
I've had private messages as well with respect to my posts about schools out West.  I think there are two interesting aspects of people sending private messages rather than posting:

1.  The site is set up to favor long-time or very frequent posters.  You can't applaud/smite (what's up with "smite," by the way?  Sounds pretty extreme if we're just talking about disagree over something) unless you've reached a certain number of posts.  So, the only way you can simply encourage continued posting or register appreciation, is to write thanks in a post, which most people think isn't much of a contribution, or to do a private message, which I, for one, appreciate because I don't really know if ANYBODY reads my posts, but doesn't register much as activity on the board for frequent lurkers.

True. And the threshold for apportioning karma to a post (applauding or smiting) is 200 posts, which may not sound like much to the board's old hands but is an insurmountably huge number for those who aren't looking to go all-in and become a regular poster.

And I agree 100% about appreciating private messages from lurkers, although almost all of the PMs I receive (other than poll notices from jknezek) are related to the basketball and football spaces on d3boards.com. Lurkers, if you want to thank me or to have at me with brickbats and cudgels, don't hesitate to PM me!

Quote from: Kuiper on September 21, 2023, 01:17:34 PM2.  In my experience, many new posters are either new to D3 (because their kid just committed or started playing) or have kids considering playing in D3 and they are trying to learn more.  In neither case do the parents have a lot of strong opinions or takes to share on the board and very little information or perspective to share about other schools (e.g., if you are new to D3, you may have heard of some really well-known academic schools, but you probably have no idea which schools are traditional powers and you've probably never heard of the vast majority of schools unless you live in the general vicinity).  This is even a bigger issue in a place like the West Coast where there are very few D3 schools in the general vicinity.  My guess is very, very few schools, coaches, or parents, let alone players on the West Coast are aware that this board exists.  In fact, on the West Coast, it's only a small subset of parents or students who are aware that small liberal arts colleges in the Midwest, Mid-Atlantic, and Northeast exist.  And even among that small subset, they basically all know about the same few schools, they have no idea what "NESCAC" is, and most think D3 means rec soccer in college (like the Hollywood finance guy who said to me he really didn't want his kid, who was mediocre at best, to play soccer seriously in college - "I just want him to go play at a place like Amherst.").  For these new posters, the threads are great for information, but it's a one-way street.

Vey true as well. I don't think it's just a West Coast thing, either. This is strictly anecdotal on my part, so take it for what it's worth, but my conversations with fans of midwestern D3 programs that have made some noise on the national level (Wheaton, Chicago, St. Olaf, Luther, a few others, as well as my own alma mater) is that the awareness that there's even a d3boards.com section that includes D3 men's soccer message boards is very low. A huge percentage of what I'd consider to be pretty dedicated fans don't even know that d3boards.com exists. And those who are aware of it tend to skew older, demographically speaking.

The one D3 men's soccer program that I've noticed really had a significant following of younger posters was Loras, back when Dan Rothert was still coaching there and the Duhawks were an annual national force. I called those posters "the Katzenjammer Kids," because, while they knew soccer well enough to bandy about whether it was wise for Rothert to use one of his CBs as a sweeper, they seemed to be more interested in talking smack than in talking shop. But even before Rothert resigned on the eve of the Covid outbreak those Loras guys had all moved on and stopped posting.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell

northman

I'm not a frequent poster, and admittedly am Bowdoin and NESCAC-centric...but I have to say that I truly appreciate the culture, sense of humor, and dedication among the most frequent posters on this board.

EnmoreCat

One of the advantages of being in the same hemisphere, if only for a few weeks, plus being on holiday, is the chance to review things here in semi-real time.  I can assure you this is a lot better than seeing a sea of "new" in the morning and trying get through work emails faster to check out what has happened in much more important theatres, like D3.  That of course means that I am more active also...

If I had never ever been exposed to the wonderful world of D3 then I can only imagine the Lord of the Flies type anti-Amherst frenzy in here, but equally, I get that people feel that way.  However, being Australian means I am unlikely to back down either, on the keyboard at least.

The one thing I have discovered on this trip is that lots and lots of people read these boards and for some strange reason, pay attention to what we say.  These same people are happy to "read only", in most cases, but certainly in terms of the Mammoths nation, more than a few have told me they like me taking up the online cudgel.

I will say that I have had the very good fortune to physically meet a few opposition NESCAC parents who are regulars in here, as well as correspond offline with several others from other conferences and it's always good to get someone else's perspective on things.  So, please, keep it coming.  I think for the most part our sons have had/are having what is best described as the time of their lives.  Ultimately, that's what it's all about. 


PaulNewman

Quote from: EnmoreCat on September 21, 2023, 02:06:43 PM
One of the advantages of being in the same hemisphere, if only for a few weeks, plus being on holiday, is the chance to review things here in semi-real time.  I can assure you this is a lot better than seeing a sea of "new" in the morning and trying get through work emails faster to check out what has happened in much more important theatres, like D3.  That of course means that I am more active also...

If I had never ever been exposed to the wonderful world of D3 then I can only imagine the Lord of the Flies type anti-Amherst frenzy in here, but equally, I get that people feel that way.  However, being Australian means I am unlikely to back down either, on the keyboard at least.

The one thing I have discovered on this trip is that lots and lots of people read these boards and for some strange reason, pay attention to what we say.  These same people are happy to "read only", in most cases, but certainly in terms of the Mammoths nation, more than a few have told me they like me taking up the online cudgel.

I will say that I have had the very good fortune to physically meet a few opposition NESCAC parents who are regulars in here, as well as correspond offline with several others from other conferences and it's always good to get someone else's perspective on things.  So, please, keep it coming.  I think for the most part our sons have had/are having what is best described as the time of their lives.  Ultimately, that's what it's all about.

Sounds like you're almost saying Amherst WANTS detractors and haters as part of its identity?  Which creates another layer of exclusivity?

I used to help some kids with their college search from our very middling public high school in Massachusetts.  One really smart but quiet kid from a barely middle class background in the end was trying to decide between Rochester and Holy Cross.  I was disappointed that he was gonna pick Holy Cross and the irony the next year is that my daughter chose Rochester over NYU, Bryn Mawr, and Macalester.  Then I was disappointed again because i wanted her to pick Macalester.  NYU imo is just ridiculously expensive and obviously a very different kind of college experience.  Anyway, maybe 6-8 weeks went by and I got a call from the kid in the middle of the school day that he had been accepted off the waitlist at Amherst.  Him, his family, and the entire school was ecstatic, and as far as I know he did quite well there.  Certainly some of the excitement was about the unquestioned excellence but there's also just the symbolism...IF you've been in the chase for elite liberal arts colleges or have some reason to know about that.  What I've allowed myself to start learning in the past handful of years about NESCAC/Ivy is that yes, these are wonderful, gorgeous schools, but average to above average schools can be just fine and in fact are fine.  What a relief it must be for some to go to a dinner party and when the parents go around asking what colleges their kids attend as kind of social acceptability test they very proudly and zero hesitation answer that their kid chose a SUNYAC or NJAC or went to Hanover (Mike Pence) or Maryville.  I am envious of that level of freedom from some cultural crap that perhaps has outlived its time.

I think Maine Soccer Fan nailed it.  I told the story once (and maybe 10 times) about being 15 miles from Gambier in my rental, going thru a drive-thru, and asking the kid which direction for Kenyon.  He basically said "what's a kenyon?"  And even most people in Massachusetts don't know about Williams or Amherst and certainly aren't enamored (or intimidated) by the social/cultural reverberations of schools in that category.

Akin to the Ivy League, NESCAC is a pretty limited cultural phenomenon that within its own circle thinks of itself as, and in some ways is, a bastion of excellence.  It's a blue blood kind of thing with a good number of children of alums.  I'm sure the networking within that circle is strong and powerful...pretty consistent with the idea of "northeastern elites."  I regret that it's only been in the last handful of years that I've tried to challenge my own elitism.  I was as gung ho as anybody, and I couldn't wait to take my kids of big college trip tours and interviews...

PaulNewman

This is what happens when I take a sick day....space available for an overactive mind.

I'm now remembering why I was so ambivalent and used to defend Amherst.  Had zero to with soccer and everything to do with my love and fascination toward the brilliant (which doesn't close to doing justice) tragic figure named David Foster Wallace...one of the most brilliant writers of the past 50 or more years.  He also was a highly rated regionally ranked tennis player who played tennis at Amherst.  His father was a professor of philosophy at Amherst. Further, around that time I came across what is considered one of the greatest commencement speeches ever...that DFW gave at...Kenyon.  I can never hate Amherst because of DFW.  Just google David Foster Wallace and Kenyon.  The speech turned into a famous little book called someting like "water is water."


WUPHF

Quote from: PaulNewman on September 21, 2023, 02:37:42 PM
I used to help some kids with their college search from our very middling public high school in Massachusetts.  One really smart but quiet kid from a barely middle class background in the end was trying to decide between Rochester and Holy Cross.  I was disappointed that he was gonna pick Holy Cross and the irony the next year is that my daughter chose Rochester over NYU, Bryn Mawr, and Macalester.  Then I was disappointed again because i wanted her to pick Macalester.  NYU imo is just ridiculously expensive and obviously a very different kind of college experience.  Anyway, maybe 6-8 weeks went by and I got a call from the kid in the middle of the school day that he had been accepted off the wait list at Amherst.  Him, his family, and the entire school was ecstatic, and as far as I know he did quite well there.  Certainly some of the excitement was about the unquestioned excellence but there's also just the symbolism...IF you've been in the chase for elite liberal arts colleges or have some reason to know about that.  What I've allowed myself to start learning in the past handful of years about NESCAC/Ivy is that yes, these are wonderful, gorgeous schools, but average to above average schools can be just fine and in fact are fine.  What a relief it must be for some to go to a dinner party and when the parents go around asking what colleges their kids attend as kind of social acceptability test they very proudly and zero hesitation answer that their kid chose a SUNYAC or NJAC or went to Hanover (Mike Pence) or Maryville.  I am envious of that level of freedom from some cultural crap that perhaps has outlived its time.

I appreciate the sentiment, but I come from a FGLI background and I'll be honest, I will do a lot to prepare my kid to compete for an elite university admission.  Not because the classroom experience will be better (it will not!), but because of everything else about the experience and name on the resume that will help with the job search.

PaulNewman

Quote from: WUPHF on September 21, 2023, 03:37:17 PM
Quote from: PaulNewman on September 21, 2023, 02:37:42 PM
I used to help some kids with their college search from our very middling public high school in Massachusetts.  One really smart but quiet kid from a barely middle class background in the end was trying to decide between Rochester and Holy Cross.  I was disappointed that he was gonna pick Holy Cross and the irony the next year is that my daughter chose Rochester over NYU, Bryn Mawr, and Macalester.  Then I was disappointed again because i wanted her to pick Macalester.  NYU imo is just ridiculously expensive and obviously a very different kind of college experience.  Anyway, maybe 6-8 weeks went by and I got a call from the kid in the middle of the school day that he had been accepted off the wait list at Amherst.  Him, his family, and the entire school was ecstatic, and as far as I know he did quite well there.  Certainly some of the excitement was about the unquestioned excellence but there's also just the symbolism...IF you've been in the chase for elite liberal arts colleges or have some reason to know about that.  What I've allowed myself to start learning in the past handful of years about NESCAC/Ivy is that yes, these are wonderful, gorgeous schools, but average to above average schools can be just fine and in fact are fine.  What a relief it must be for some to go to a dinner party and when the parents go around asking what colleges their kids attend as kind of social acceptability test they very proudly and zero hesitation answer that their kid chose a SUNYAC or NJAC or went to Hanover (Mike Pence) or Maryville.  I am envious of that level of freedom from some cultural crap that perhaps has outlived its time.

I appreciate the sentiment, but I come from a FGLI background and I'll be honest, I will do a lot to prepare my kid to compete for an elite university admission.  Not because the classroom experience will be better (it will not!), but because of everything else about the experience and name on the resume that will help with the job search.

I get it.  And schools advertise the hell out of persons like you, similar to extolling their improving records with persons of color.   

My parents both went to Transy.  Both grew up in the Eastern KY mountains (Appalachia).  My father, a surgeon, tried to talk me into going to Woodberry Forest in Orange, VA.  My end choices were Davidson and W&L.  Then I continued the culture that my father made possible for me with my kids.  Once you earn, or someone before you earned, privilege, why would anyone not take advantage of that?  So the hard truth is that I would do something very, very similar to what I did before with my kids if I could do it all over again.

And I told myself I wasn't gonna post today!

Gregory Sager

Quote from: WUPHF on September 21, 2023, 03:37:17 PM
Quote from: PaulNewman on September 21, 2023, 02:37:42 PM
I used to help some kids with their college search from our very middling public high school in Massachusetts.  One really smart but quiet kid from a barely middle class background in the end was trying to decide between Rochester and Holy Cross.  I was disappointed that he was gonna pick Holy Cross and the irony the next year is that my daughter chose Rochester over NYU, Bryn Mawr, and Macalester.  Then I was disappointed again because i wanted her to pick Macalester.  NYU imo is just ridiculously expensive and obviously a very different kind of college experience.  Anyway, maybe 6-8 weeks went by and I got a call from the kid in the middle of the school day that he had been accepted off the wait list at Amherst.  Him, his family, and the entire school was ecstatic, and as far as I know he did quite well there.  Certainly some of the excitement was about the unquestioned excellence but there's also just the symbolism...IF you've been in the chase for elite liberal arts colleges or have some reason to know about that.  What I've allowed myself to start learning in the past handful of years about NESCAC/Ivy is that yes, these are wonderful, gorgeous schools, but average to above average schools can be just fine and in fact are fine.  What a relief it must be for some to go to a dinner party and when the parents go around asking what colleges their kids attend as kind of social acceptability test they very proudly and zero hesitation answer that their kid chose a SUNYAC or NJAC or went to Hanover (Mike Pence) or Maryville.  I am envious of that level of freedom from some cultural crap that perhaps has outlived its time.

I appreciate the sentiment, but I come from a FGLI background and I'll be honest, I will do a lot to prepare my kid to compete for an elite university admission.  Not because the classroom experience will be better (it will not!), but because of everything else about the experience and name on the resume that will help with the job search.

This.

One of the most unforgettable conversations I had in my twenties was with the valedictorian of my high-school class, whom I bumped into at a New Year's Eve party when I was home in upstate NY visiting my parents for the holidays five years out of high school. My high school was the largest in upstate NY, with a student population of around four thousand, so to be the valedictorian of a class of about a thousand students was a very big deal. He went to Harvard on a full ride.

He and I grew up on the same street and were in all of the same honors classes, and thus we were friends despite the huge size of our graduating class. So we were talking at this party, and out of the blue he asked, "So, how did you like North Park?" He only knew of the school's existence because I had gone there. I told him how much of a transformative and positive experience it had been for me after really hating high school, and then I asked in turn, "So, how was Harvard?" And he looked me in the eye and said -- I'll never forget this -- "Well, it was fine, but I'll bet that you got a better education than I did."

He was a very earnest type, not the kind of guy to kid around. Nevertheless, I exclaimed, "Are you kidding me? I got a better education than I would've gotten at Harvard? Look, I didn't go to a school like [name of a SUNY school that I won't repeat here out of fear of needlessly creating enemies], but North Park is no Harvard!"

He replied, "How big is North Park?"

"About 1,200 students."

"And I'll bet that you never had a class taught by a teaching assistant."

"No, I didn't. Just profs." (I'm dating myself here, because this was in the days before non-tenured "gypsy" adjunct instructors became a fixture at just about every level of higher education.)

"Your average class size was ... what?"

"About fifteen students or so."

"And you knew your professors, right? I mean, well enough to be on a first-name basis with them, or maybe you even socialized with them. True?"

"True."

He then explained to me that he hadn't taken a class taught by an actual professor until the end of his sophomore year, that no professor ever learned his name (much less socialized with him), and that a fair number of his classes had really large numbers of students. And, he added, you learned pretty quickly at Harvard that, despite the whole "best and brightest" propaganda that the Ivy League churns out, there's a fair number of students there whose superlatives were more along the lines of "richest and most well-connected." In other words, he was fully aware that the actual circumstances involving one's academic experience often don't line up with the common perception thereof.

He than quickly added that, despite this, he would not have traded his Harvard education for anything, because of what WUPHF pointed out -- the school's name on the résumé -- as well as the connections he made. And those things paid off for him, as he was awarded a full Bausch & Lomb scholarship to the University of Rochester's School of Medicine and Dentistry (motto: "Our bedside manner doesn't require a paywall") and has since had a long career as an oncologist in Texas. All of which goes to show that perceptiveness is at least as useful as book smarts in going through life.
"To see what is in front of one's nose is a constant struggle." -- George Orwell