NCAA TOURNAMENT 2024

[eaglesoccerdad]

nah - perfectly ok to ignore VAR. camera angles are suspect and make the VAR review just as subjective as the call on the field

[Kuiper]

kuiper, with all due respect (and I'll do this again - when I say that I mean it, you are legend on this board) a lot of stuff that gets posted in the rule changes thread gets pretty tedious and quite often over-looked.

But, more to the point, has anyone seen a regular season or up to this point NCAA tournament game where VAR gets trotted out??

Either it's part of the game or it's not. Bringing it in at the Final Four stage, in my opinion, is not the correct course.

I didn't even focus on this in the rule change thread (wait a minute . . . are you saying that no one really reads my off-season posts!  ).  I saw it and assumed that was really for DI.  Heck, many D3 games don't even have working streams and certainly not multiple cameras, so I thought it wouldn't really be used in these games.  Maybe it was.  To be fair, the video game improved this year at many schools, with more multiple angles (e.g., Trinity) and more drone usage (e.g., Pomona-Pitzer and UC Santa Cruz), but I didn't see any VAR reviews in D3 games.  Maybe they happened. 

I have seen it used in DI games though.  For example, it was used in the Pitt win over Kansas City in the tournament on Sunday

https://pittsburghsoccernow.com/2024/12/04/analysis-staying-with-the-process-pitt-mens-soccer-overcome-obstacles-in-ncaa-tournament-run/

They confirmed that a goal scored was offside

Pitt quickly accelerated through the final seconds to get into position for one last push at goal — when Casper Svenby advanced into the right side of the box, then delivered a perfect ball across for Luis Sahmkow, who delivered a clinical finish that appeared (for a second or two) to be the game-winner with just one second left on the countdown clock used in NCAA soccer.

The goal was immediately waved off — and the officials went to VAR to confirm the call on the field.

https://x.com/pghsoccernow/status/1863375057013133609

[SKUD]

So we can say it was a horrible call but more horrible would be to ignore it.

I did see it on a 56" tv in slow motion.  it looked like he might have gotten ball (inconclusive) and then tripped the player in the box. I am not a ref and don't have a rule book. If it played out how I saw it, is it a foul or not?

[Bucket]

So we can say it was a horrible call but more horrible would be to ignore it.

I did see it on a 56" tv in slow motion.  it looked like he might have gotten ball (inconclusive) and then tripped the player in the box. I am not a ref and don't have a rule book. If it played out how I saw it, is it a foul or not?

Seems to me he obviously got the ball—it changes direction—then slides through the player.

Either way, if inconclusive, then one must defer to the call on the field, no?

[nescac1]

As someone with no stake in the outcome, neither of those plays was a clear foul at all.  And certainly not a foul warranting a PK. That's an insane call, no justification.  Especially overturning the call on the field.  Wow what a ****ty way to lose. 

[boomer]

So we can say it was a horrible call but more horrible would be to ignore it.

I did see it on a 56" tv in slow motion.  it looked like he might have gotten ball (inconclusive) and then tripped the player in the box. I am not a ref and don't have a rule book. If it played out how I saw it, is it a foul or not?

Where's college soccer observer when you need him!

[soccerlaxfan]

kuiper, with all due respect (and I'll do this again - when I say that I mean it, you are legend on this board) a lot of stuff that gets posted in the rule changes thread gets pretty tedious and quite often over-looked.

But, more to the point, has anyone seen a regular season or up to this point NCAA tournament game where VAR gets trotted out??

Either it's part of the game or it's not. Bringing it in at the Final Four stage, in my opinion, is not the correct course.

Denison used it in the regular season a few times

[nescac1]

The defender clearly got the ball.  And the thing with that call that is so killer is that the Amherst guy was dribbling into a wall of three white shirts at the very edge of the box.  It would not remotely have been a scoring opportunity but for the call.  If it's a very clear foul, yeah, the refs have no choice but to make the call but when it's not clear (if at all) you simply can't gift a team a PK from a situation in which there was no advantage for the offense. 

[Hopkins92]

Ok.. Able to go back and watch those plays in the run of play and with the benefit of 1000 replays.

Terrible terrible terrible.

The exact same situations. Don't call either, let the game go on.

My god. NESCAC folks are fully aware, that stuff NEVER gets called.

Wow.

[Bucket]

The defender clearly got the ball.  And the thing with that call that is so killer is that the Amherst guy was dribbling into a wall of three white shirts at the very edge of the box.  It would not remotely have been a scoring opportunity but for the call.  If it's a very clear foul, yeah, the refs have no choice but to make the call but when it's not clear (if at all) you simply can't gift a team a PK from a situation in which there was no advantage for the offense.

Especially when you didn't call it in real time (!), and then view on replay shows nothing conclusive. (Though I'd argue the replay shows conclusively that Farrell got the ball first)

It's shocking, honestly. (And I know I'm saying this as a Midd diehard, but there really doesn't seem to be a reasonable argument otherwise.)

[SKUD]

Thank you NES that makes sense.

Sorry Bucket your vision is not good when you don't have a weeping willow shading you

[Bucket]

Thank you NES that makes sense.

Sorry Bucket your vision is not good when you don't have a weeping willow shading you

I like that observation, my friend. Though I'd argue my view of the video was the same as the center ref's!

[Kuiper]

kuiper, with all due respect (and I'll do this again - when I say that I mean it, you are legend on this board) a lot of stuff that gets posted in the rule changes thread gets pretty tedious and quite often over-looked.

But, more to the point, has anyone seen a regular season or up to this point NCAA tournament game where VAR gets trotted out??

Either it's part of the game or it's not. Bringing it in at the Final Four stage, in my opinion, is not the correct course.

Denison used it in the regular season a few times

I never watched a Denison home game, but that's exactly the kind of situation where I could see it being used in DIII.  Denison built a brand new field complex and Coach Bianco is very knowledgeable about NCAA rules from his time on the soccer competition committee.  I wouldn't be surprised if he had places for multiple cameras installed on the field and video replay equipment purchased as part of the construction project and then proceeded to inform referees of its availability so they could inspect it and approve its use during the games.

[SKUD]

Now if we could only take the color person off her ignorant talking points.

[PaulNewman]

The stove is too hot to be commenting now, but of course no one will be that interested once the temperature cools off.

Just one observer's opinion...

First of all, did the players know VAR might be used?  Imo the answer was not to award the first challenge with a PK.  The contact was too marginal and as far I could tell had no real impact on whether Amherst was going to get a good scoring chance in that spot.  That said, and I say this believing the ref had plenty of room to conclude "inconclusive," I did think on multiple reviews that the Midd player did get the Amherst player marginally on the foot before touching the ball.  The second one imo was extremely similar to the first one but imo not exactly the same.  The ref I presume knew the first call could have gone either way and was probably realizing he was injecting himself into a marginal call, and so when the second play happened I would guess he hoped there was room to make a legit PK call.  He didn't see it and so didn't stop the action, but on appeal after the Midd YC he immediately agreed to go look.  I presume he would have given a PK there if he had seen anything to justify it.  Imo Murphy did touch the ball before player.

Very impressed with Midd's midfield and offensive talent but I kept wanting to see more of it.  They had spells in the 2nd half where they looked effective and dangerous but not much in the first half.  That team is too talented to go the last 200 minutes of the season with only 1 goal.  I would have expected Midd to come out of the gate on fire looking to stun Amherst with a 2-0 lead after 25-30 minutes.  A cagey match especially now in hindsight probably was always going to favor the Mammoths.  And you absolutely cannot allow the Kitten score in the first minute of the 2nd half off a corner.

I noticed what seemed like good sportsmanship in the end also, and that was good to see.  The Midd players did not look like they felt the game was stolen from them based on their immediate postgame reactions.  They also didn't seem to flip out when the ref came back from VAR with the PK call.  I'm sure he doesn't not care one little bit, but Nuhu for such an incredibly talented player sure does make himself hard to like. 

Very hard match to watch, but we knew that would most likely be the case.  Congrats to Middlebury on a fantastic season.  They did get a breakthrough in reaching the F4 and they certainly were good enough to prevail today, but I can't go so far as to say it was taken from them.